revtothelimit - motorbike forum

KungFooBob wrote: Sun Aug 16, 2020 2:26 pm

Yorick wrote: Sun Aug 16, 2020 2:24 pm

formula400 wrote: Sun Aug 16, 2020 11:58 am There is no guarantee Lorenzo would of got Ducati a world title, stoner nearly did

You've said a lot lately about racing that's baffled me. But surely you remember Stoner winning the championship on a Ducati ?

Twice.

2007 Ducati.
2011 Honda.

My bad.

KungFooBob wrote: Sun Aug 16, 2020 2:33 pmMy bad.

I'll let it go, just this once. Must try harder.

Yorick wrote: Sun Aug 16, 2020 2:24 pm

formula400 wrote: Sun Aug 16, 2020 11:58 am There is no guarantee Lorenzo would of got Ducati a world title, stoner nearly did

You've said a lot lately about racing that's baffled me. But surely you remember Stoner winning the championship on a Ducati ?

Sorry forgot half of what I wanted to type.

Yes he won a championship on the Ducati and he could of won another if it was not for his Illness (well he was on course for it)

Yorick wrote: Sun Aug 16, 2020 2:31 pm

KungFooBob wrote: Sun Aug 16, 2020 2:26 pm

Yorick wrote: Sun Aug 16, 2020 2:24 pm
You've said a lot lately about racing that's baffled me. But surely you remember Stoner winning the championship on a Ducati ?

Twice.

2007 Ducati.
2011 Honda.

Yes yes

Yeah that Dovi he's crap ain't he.

Ps. If Marc hadn't of been rash he'd be walking this championship

Supermofo wrote: Sun Aug 16, 2020 3:52 pm Yeah that Dovi he's crap ain't he.

Ps. If Marc hadn't of been rash he'd be walking this championship

Maybe, but he outrode himself. A part of me feels he rode his luck for too long.
I wonder how he'll go when he gets back? He can ride for wins, not championship points. But will his bravery been dulled a bit? I hope not.

Dovi is far from crap. Just not a Moto GP world champ,
Let’s face it, this is his only chance in how ever long as this year as 93 is gone. Yes he’s beat him in a few races but last season they all looked average compared to him, just like Rossi used to make people look.

Yorick wrote: Sun Aug 16, 2020 3:57 pm

Supermofo wrote: Sun Aug 16, 2020 3:52 pm Yeah that Dovi he's crap ain't he.

Ps. If Marc hadn't of been rash he'd be walking this championship

Maybe, but he outrode himself. A part of me feels he rode his luck for too long.
I wonder how he'll go when he gets back? He can ride for wins, not championship points. But will his bravery been dulled a bit? I hope not.

Thats the $64m question. To be fair if he wound it back just a little he'd still win and be safer but it doesn't work like that.

It’s just like Formula 1 at the present time.

Plenty top class drivers but up against possibly one of the all time greats.

If you remove Marquez from the equation as he is just now you get the best of the rest.

It’s difficult to praise any one rider as being ‘great’ when you know on an average Sunday he’s going to come off second best.

There's a lot of ifs and assumptions.

No one really knows how good Marc is compared to Dovi because they're on completely different machines.

The bit about Dovi and do or die makes me smile, how's that working out for Marc and Honda at the moment? As for Dovi needing more do or die, he's shown that when it comes to last corner antics he can out think Marc and win.

There's a lot of talk about how hard the Honda is to ride, no one says that about the Ducati yet Rossi and Burgess couldn't make it work, Hayden couldn't, nor Crutchlow, Miller's getting there but he has to destroy his tyres to do it, the best performing rider on it is Dovi.

His biggest problem is he's a quiet self-effacing person with a very smooth in-line style who thinks and gets the best out of the bike without crashing, very effective but not a crowd pleaser.

He took a 40% pay cut this year because of Covid, Ducati hummed and Haad and said they'd make a decision after the next two rounds, that's taking the piss. I can't blame him for telling them to poke it even if there isn't an alternative this year. He's consistently got the best out of the bike, worked away at developing it and they publicly criticise him, they need to have a word with themselves.

I wonder what Audi are thinking? All these top riders race a Ducati, get nowhere and the same management remain. They've built a bike full of gizmos and still no championship. Must be the riders

Rossi to say - screw this, I'm too old to be head butting flying bikes, Dovi - Mr Smooth to Petronas Yam, perfect match - cleans up.

Scotsrich wrote: Mon Aug 17, 2020 8:21 am It’s just like Formula 1 at the present time.

Plenty top class drivers but up against possibly one of the all time greats.

If you remove Marquez from the equation as he is just now you get the best of the rest.

It’s difficult to praise any one rider as being ‘great’ when you know on an average Sunday he’s going to come off second best.

But all the riders ride on that knife edge between consistency and crashing/injury. The old adage of to finish first...etc stands true. Yes MM is the fastest man out there,but by his own hand,he's not out there and those riders playing the longer game will win.

I don't watch the racing thinking I'm looking at the race for second,because MM isn't there,I'm watching whoever is best on the day winning and beating MM because he isn't there.

crust wrote: Mon Aug 17, 2020 1:48 pm
The bit about Dovi and do or die makes me smile, how's that working out for Marc and Honda at the moment?

Watch the documentary. Thats what Ducati seem to think, which is why they ummm and ahhhhed and IMO made a mistake. There are some really awkward moments in that film and doesn't look like Ducati were fully supporting him. Ducati management actually say Dovi thinks too much and he should just go for it, I reckon they see Marc and think Dovi needs to be the same but they are very different. Dovi will get the best out of the bike but he'll not risk throwing it away. Whereas Marc dances that line all the time. And now he's been bitten. But I think Ducati can only see whats winning and think Dovi needs to do the same.

Funny though last 2 riders who've been fucked over by Ducati and have then gone on to win.

Skub wrote: Mon Aug 17, 2020 1:51 pm
I don't watch the racing thinking I'm looking at the race for second,because MM isn't there,I'm watching whoever is best on the day winning and beating MM because he isn't there.

I think without MM the racing has been brilliant.

i don't get people not loving Marc, he's raised the bar and no one can really compete (young, quick, aggressive, happy ruthless, a bit like rossi was when he dominated), yeah Dovi has got him a few times on the last corner but thats does not mean much as he's still not a Moto GP champion, all those boys are very good in that class, but 1 or 2 of them are slightly better than the rest.

regardless, people will look back and say he won because Marc was not there. (that is if Dovi wins)

And who decides what bike is the best in the paddock??? loads say the Ducati, then loads say the Yamaha, surly the best bike is the one the world champion sits on??? a bike/rider can't win with out the other, plus the riders have different styles so surly that comes into it??

Supermofo wrote: Mon Aug 17, 2020 3:25 pm

Skub wrote: Mon Aug 17, 2020 1:51 pm
I don't watch the racing thinking I'm looking at the race for second,because MM isn't there,I'm watching whoever is best on the day winning and beating MM because he isn't there.

I think without MM the racing has been brilliant.

ill enjoyed Fabio/Pecco/Binder but you must admit seeing Marc almost crash and them carve though the field was a great watch as well.

formula400 wrote: Tue Aug 18, 2020 12:58 am

Supermofo wrote: Mon Aug 17, 2020 3:25 pm

Skub wrote: Mon Aug 17, 2020 1:51 pm
I don't watch the racing thinking I'm looking at the race for second,because MM isn't there,I'm watching whoever is best on the day winning and beating MM because he isn't there.

I think without MM the racing has been brilliant.

ill enjoyed Fabio/Pecco/Binder but you must admit seeing Marc almost crash and them carve though the field was a great watch as well.

I reckon you take comments too literally. I don't have a favourite in racing I just like the racing. But Marc is head and shoulders better than the others and is amazing to watch. Like Stoner I could watch Marc ride round an empty track, he is proper exciting to watch and has changed motogp. And as good as Rossi etc were Marc seems to be alone in being able to step up even more at times as evidenced by his being able to ride through a field after mistakes time and again. But he's shown the risk he takes with that now.

I just hope he is OK and comes back to racing without being knackered. There are a lot of Marc haters who mainly seem to be Rossi fans which is something I never got. Rossi was amazing but for me its not like football, I don't have a favourite and I don't get the hump when someone better comes along. I think most people on her love watching Marc too.

My point about the racing is if Marc hadn't of smashed himself up and with this amount of inconsistency from everyone else he'd be gone in the championship already. And there would have been no Binder win, no will Zarco or Frankie do it, no can Rins/Mir get one, or Pecco at Jerez. That's made the racing exciting too.

Supermofo wrote: Tue Aug 18, 2020 7:45 am

formula400 wrote: Tue Aug 18, 2020 12:58 am

Supermofo wrote: Mon Aug 17, 2020 3:25 pm

I think without MM the racing has been brilliant.

ill enjoyed Fabio/Pecco/Binder but you must admit seeing Marc almost crash and them carve though the field was a great watch as well.

I reckon you take comments too literally. I don't have a favourite in racing I just like the racing. But Marc is head and shoulders better than the others and is amazing to watch. Like Stoner I could watch Marc ride round an empty track, he is proper exciting to watch and has changed motogp. And as good as Rossi etc were Marc seems to be alone in being able to step up even more at times as evidenced by his being able to ride through a field after mistakes time and again. But he's shown the risk he takes with that now.

I just hope he is OK and comes back to racing without being knackered. There are a lot of Marc haters who mainly seem to be Rossi fans which is something I never got. Rossi was amazing but for me its not like football, I don't have a favourite and I don't get the hump when someone better comes along. I think most people on her love watching Marc too.

My point about the racing is if Marc hadn't of smashed himself up and with this amount of inconsistency from everyone else he'd be gone in the championship already. And there would have been no Binder win, no will Zarco or Frankie do it, no can Rins/Mir get one, or Pecco at Jerez. That's made the racing exciting too.

Impossible to say though, if he'd not spannered himself in that session he could have had a mechanical, tyre or indeed any one of anohter 5 crashes...

Marquez wins because he takes risks, Marquez crashes because he takes risks, therefore Marquez crashing and taking himself out for 2020 is a risk that he took, whoever wins in 2020 will have beaten Marquez because Marquez had a ride on a competitive bike for the whole of 2020.

I think Jack MIller is a brave man, He's the the next in a long line of quality riders who will be held responsible for Ducati not winning championships. You would have thought they'd have learned their lesson by the time Lorenzo finally started winning - its not just the rider. A classic example of repeating the same thing and expecting a different outcome each time.

The other thing Ducati has managed to do is create the ugliest MotoGP bike ever to grace the grid (IMO of course). The V2 roadbike is a thing of beauty for a sports motorcycle and they manage to re-define ugly with their flagship race bike. Heads should roll !!