Would you have an electric car if you had the money for a new car and were in the market for one?

[moth]

Things won't be getting any better with the latest building code that prohibits new construction using gas & everything has to be 100% electric...

That's happening here in 2023. The grid can cope, it's not transmission that's the problem it's distribution.

[moth]

From the research I done - it appears electric cars only become greener than a conventional car, at around twice the average life expectancy of a current new car in Europe. And that’s assuming it gets that far on one battery cell pack, which it clearly won’t.

This is a fools rush to a tech that does nothing but move the pollution.

UNDERACHIEVER!

Or realist...

Mr Dazzle begs to differ. Sunlit uplands, unicorns...

[ZRX61]

From the research I done - it appears electric cars only become greener than a conventional car, at around twice the average life expectancy of a current new car in Europe. And that’s assuming it gets that far on one battery cell pack, which it clearly won’t.

This is a fools rush to a tech that does nothing but move the pollution.

I've seen reports of $7000k battery replacement cost for a Prius. We have a factory here in town making electric buses & the AVTA (local bus company) uses them. A few of them have gone up in flames & there's now lawsuits regarding mileage claims which were more than a bit optimistic.
Seem to be working better than their plan for methanol powered buses.. no one told them about the corrosion issues with methanol & aluminum..

[ZRX61]

That's happening here in 2023. The grid can cope, it's not transmission that's the problem it's distribution.

Out here in the Mojave we have thousands of acres of solar & also 5000+ windmills. There was a 20+ year gap between planting the windmills & having sufficient power line capacity to connect more than a third of the output to the grid.
Just about the entire valley west of town has been approved for solar farms, an area of around 300,000 acres.

[demographic]

Fuck no. My State doesn't have the grid capacity to run all the stuff we already have & at least once they've told people not to charge their Tesla's etc to prevent brown outs. Things won't be getting any better with the latest building code that prohibits new construction using gas & everything has to be 100% electric... which is going to work really well with them closing down dozens of back up plants that use gas turbines to generate power & refusal to build any new generating plants. We have less generating power than when the population was half what it is now.
So basically:
Double population.
Decrease generating capacity
Force everyone to 100% electricity use.
Ban new gas powered cars in 15 years
They turn off the power when it gets windy.
If anyone can explain the logic behind this, please educate the rest of us.

Your state would greatly benefit from storage capacity for the renewable energy it produces and damn near pays other states for them to take it away.
Just imagine if they had cars that could take that power?

Vehicle to grid storage also helps balance grid energy needs. Worth looking at.

[ZRX61]

Your state would greatly benefit from storage capacity for the renewable energy it produces and damn near pays other states for them to take it away.
Just imagine if they had cars that could take that power?

Vehicle to grid storage also helps balance grid energy needs. Worth looking at.

Wind/Solar here is less than 3%

[demographic]

Your state would greatly benefit from storage capacity for the renewable energy it produces and damn near pays other states for them to take it away.
Just imagine if they had cars that could take that power?

Vehicle to grid storage also helps balance grid energy needs. Worth looking at.

Wind/Solar here is less than 3%

Quite possible I'm wrong (I'm married after all) but I'm pretty sure I heard they shipped a lot of the lecky to other states at peak production times.

Random link I from Brietbart, dunno how reliable it is but ties in with what I've heard.
https://www.breitbart.com/local/2017/06 ... lar-power/

[ZRX61]

Quite possible I'm wrong (I'm married after all) but I'm pretty sure I heard they shipped a lot of the lecky to other states at peak production times.

Random link I from Brietbart, dunno how reliable it is but ties in with what I've heard.
https://www.breitbart.com/local/2017/06 ... lar-power/

https://ww2.energy.ca.gov/sitingcases/a ... s_cms.html

Apparently we dump excess(??) renewable into neighboring States, while importing nuclear from Az:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_p ... California

[Asian Boss]

Yeah I get that I'm rather more optimistic than most. I'd rather reign it in than underachieve though

Where's Iccy when you need him.

I thought he got popped and twisted by the ginger bowl boy from Bradford.

[Asian Boss]

Are they? Is that still the same once you factor in the resources they use, the shipping of the resources around the world, the manufacture and decommissioning of them when they are knackered?

What’s greener, a Tesla that will perhaps last 5 years, or my 1985 LR90 diesel that’s still plodding along?

I think there's a new-ish and increasing branch of science which quantifies whole life impacts. And that's what it says from memory.

No-one alive today needs to consider future environmental impacts, because Mr Dazzle's brilliant problem solving scientific methods will sort it. After they've sorted the environmental impacts of fossil and nuclear fuels

Engineering is easy. Paying for it may not be. But in this instance, the polluter will pay.

[moth]

I think there's a new-ish and increasing branch of science which quantifies whole life impacts. And that's what it says from memory.

No-one alive today needs to consider future environmental impacts, because Mr Dazzle's brilliant problem solving scientific methods will sort it. After they've sorted the environmental impacts of fossil and nuclear fuels

Engineering is easy. Paying for it may not be. But in this instance, the polluter will pay.

We're all polluters

[Asian Boss]

No-one alive today needs to consider future environmental impacts, because Mr Dazzle's brilliant problem solving scientific methods will sort it. After they've sorted the environmental impacts of fossil and nuclear fuels

Engineering is easy. Paying for it may not be. But in this instance, the polluter will pay.

We're all polluters

Some more than others.

[Mr. Dazzle]

I feel like this could all be solved with more textured insect protein and soya milk.

[Asian Boss]

I feel like this could all be solved with more textured insect protein and soya milk.

Meat and air travel are biggies too. They won't be ignored. The polluters will eat textured insect protein.

You're probably ok too, as you're also part of the solution. Under the hushy hushy Whitehall 'while the polluters pay, the fixers flourish' scheme you should also be entitled to a V8 car, unlimited fillet steak and two first class trips to the far east with full insurance on all boys damaged.

[Yambo]

Engineering is easy. Paying for it may not be.

The polluter may have to, HS2 is going to only get more expensive!


Of course, if everyone goes EV who will be the polluter, the electricity generators?

[demographic]

I feel like this could all be solved with more textured insect protein and soya milk.

Meat and air travel are biggies too. They won't be ignored. The polluters will eat textured insect protein.

You're probably ok too, as you're also part of the solution. Under the hushy hushy Whitehall 'while the polluters pay, the fixers flourish' scheme you should also be entitled to a V8 car, unlimited fillet steak and two first class trips to the far east with full insurance on all boys damaged.

I'll come back to this but beef is a huge water sink. The amout of water used to produce one kilo of beef is astronomical.
Personally I like the taste and where my family farmed it the water fell from the sky (lake district) so it wasnt an issue. It was proper grass fed beef but in a lot of places its an environmental disasaster.

[Skub]

[wheelnut]

I'm just thinking along the "what if all the chargers are occupied?" lines. Clearly there are enough petrol pumps to go around (probably too many in fact, can't remember the last time I saw a new garage but I've seen loads close down?)...in simple terms if there were 100 times as many charging points as there are petrol pumps that would be nominally enough. Dunno how many that is.

I expect that as people get more used to owning electric cars the whole "where am I gonna charge?" anxiety will decrease alot.

In our small provincial town, population around 35k, there’s probably around 60 fuel pumps.
By your reckoning we would need 6000 chargers, that’s a lot in a town that probably has less than 1000 public and supermarket car park spaces. Most of our town has off street parking so I would imagine most will have a home charger, but this may not be feasible in a lot of towns where on street parking is more popular.

[demographic]

To me more supermarkets need chargers, after all yer there for a good while each week. Cars doing nowt else but parking. Might as well be charging while the cars sitting doing nowt else.

Few shipping container batteries charging up on nighttime lecky launching power into cars through the day can't be that hard to organise for anyone with a brain can it?

Can also provide grid stability through the peak demand periods as well.

[Mr. Dazzle]

I'm just thinking along the "what if all the chargers are occupied?" lines. Clearly there are enough petrol pumps to go around (probably too many in fact, can't remember the last time I saw a new garage but I've seen loads close down?)...in simple terms if there were 100 times as many charging points as there are petrol pumps that would be nominally enough. Dunno how many that is.

I expect that as people get more used to owning electric cars the whole "where am I gonna charge?" anxiety will decrease alot.

In our small provincial town, population around 35k, there’s probably around 60 fuel pumps.
By your reckoning we would need 6000 chargers, that’s a lot in a town that probably has less than 1000 public and supermarket car park spaces. Most of our town has off street parking so I would imagine most will have a home charger, but this may not be feasible in a lot of towns where on street parking is more popular.

My own maths neglects the fact that pumps aren't used 100% of the time. I'm sure someone with access to much better data and know how has looked in more detail!

Few shipping container batteries charging up on nighttime lecky launching power into cars through the day can't be that hard to organise for anyone with a brain can it?

Can also provide grid stability through the peak demand periods as well.

This is the sort of thing that will really take off with small/medium scale enterprises I think. Its a self feeding business innit...make cars easier to charge, more people own electric cars, more people need charging and so on. Lots of money to be made if you're up for it. I'm not