When did you learn about being seen by HGVs ?

[Horse]

I think our eyes are pretty good at seeing things, we just need to move them around a bit and take the time required. Some driver's probably just stare at one vehicle instead of looking around to see what else is about or it's a quick glance.

Smidsy isn't a valid excuse but acceptance of dangerous driving, in my book.

I suggest spending a bit of time training your eyes on www.scienceofbeingseen.org - and hopefully you'll discover why it's really, REALLY not as simple as that.

@The Spin Doctor stick up a link to your recent blog post about seeing

[The Spin Doctor]

You mean this one?

SOBS Jun 26 Perception and why I was out riding and saw a black bear
https://ko-fi.com/post/SOBS-Jun-26-Perc ... V7V31H2IL0

[Horse]

You mean this one?

SOBS Jun 26 Perception and why I was out riding and saw a black bear
https://ko-fi.com/post/SOBS-Jun-26-Perc ... V7V31H2IL0

@Dodgy69 Have a read

[Dodgy69]

Not yet, I'll have a look tomorrow.

[demographic]

HGV's can see?
Wow, this AI business is moving fast.

[Dodgy69]

Read it. I do ask myself, how many others would also see a bear instead of the wheely bin.??

So our brain makes up an image that our eyes look at. Some folk more accurately than others i would imagine. At least he saw something and knew it was there, unlike being invisible to driver's pulling out in front of us.

Seeing something is better than seeing nothing. Thought provoking it is Hoss.

[Horse]

Read it. I do ask myself, how many others would also see a bear instead of the wheely bin.??

Or, in the example I posted, the HGV sofa.

The challenge you have, approaching a junction, is deciding whether the driver:
- has seen you
- understood whatever you 'are'
- made correct judgements of your speed and distance (ie how long does the driver have to pull out, aka 'time to contact's)
- made the correct decision on whether or not to pull out

How do you decide?
What can you do to improve your chances?
What's your contingency plan?

[cheb]

Is there any research on whether cameras are better then traditional mirrors on lorries yet?

I looked at them in a coach I was in and it looked like they were better but that was stationary.

[Dodgy69]

Read it. I do ask myself, how many others would also see a bear instead of the wheely bin.??

Or, in the example I posted, the HGV sofa.

The challenge you have, approaching a junction, is deciding whether the driver:
- has seen you
- understood whatever you 'are'
- made correct judgements of your speed and distance (ie how long does the driver have to pull out, aka 'time to contact's)
- made the correct decision on whether or not to pull out

How do you decide?
What can you do to improve your chances?
What's your contingency plan?

Where possible, I do a little left right swerve kind of thing, maybe headlight directly at car for split second, might help.

[Horse]

Is there any research on whether cameras are better then traditional mirrors on lorries yet?

I looked at them in a coach I was in and it looked like they were better but that was stationary.

Good question, I'd wondered too.

This from Volvo:

Kjell Brunnström is a senior scientist at RISE Research Institutes of Sweden, specializing in visual perception. He believes cameras can be more common and favored in the near future, but it can also be beneficial to add some aspects to the camera monitoring systems to be able to make them a preferred option for everyone and every segment in the transport industry.

“As it is now, camera monitoring systems give a reduced depth of vision compared to regular side or rear-view mirrors. But a study conducted at RISE and Volvo Cars** showed that to mitigate the reduced depth perception, the cameras should preferably present additional graphics, indicating distance and dangerous objects, which could help the driver make the correct decisions.”

** Source: Zhang, M. and G. Bin. The effect of CMS with AR on driving performance. (diva2:1717225), RISE Research Institutes of Sweden, Chalmers University of Technology, M.Sc. thesis. 2022, Available from: http://urn.kb.se/resolve?urn=urn:nbn:se:ri:diva-61469


Although slightly worrying that 'improved aerodynamics' was top of the list ...

[Horse]

Read it. I do ask myself, how many others would also see a bear instead of the wheely bin.??

Or, in the example I posted, the HGV sofa.

The challenge you have, approaching a junction, is deciding whether the driver:
- has seen you
- understood whatever you 'are'
- made correct judgements of your speed and distance (ie how long does the driver have to pull out, aka 'time to contact's)
- made the correct decision on whether or not to pull out

How do you decide?
What can you do to improve your chances?
What's your contingency plan?

Where possible, I do a little left right swerve kind of thing, maybe headlight directly at car for split second, might help.

You can improve above that with far more active positioning:

eg 'Z Line':
.

Screenshot_20250628-162200.png (124.26 KiB) Viewed 2203 times

Note: line superimposed on a US road layout

From:
https://the-ride-info.blogspot.com/2008 ... s.html?m=0

And if you've read Spin's latest blog, 'The Killing Zone', look closely how the at risk area reduces in the diagram.

[Horse]

HGV's can see?

[X] Should be in the 'possession' thread

[The Spin Doctor]

HGV's can see?
Wow, this AI business is moving fast.

Aftermarket systems on sale... such as this one...

Autowatch AI blind side detection system - AWAI
AI Blind Side Detection System
AWAI is an innovative Artificial Intelligence Driver Assistance and Pedestrian Warning System. It can monitor two cameras simultaneously and will trigger an external speaker should a pedestrian or cyclist wander into a pre-set danger zone down the side or at the back of the vehicle depending on where the cameras are installed. It will also alert the driver via a beeper on a display mounted on the A pillar inside the cabin. The 2 camera images can also be displayed on a dash or roof mounted monitor in the cab for additional Driver assistance.

[Noggin]

HGV's can see?
Wow, this AI business is moving fast.

Aftermarket systems on sale... such as this one...

Autowatch AI blind side detection system - AWAI
AI Blind Side Detection System
AWAI is an innovative Artificial Intelligence Driver Assistance and Pedestrian Warning System. It can monitor two cameras simultaneously and will trigger an external speaker should a pedestrian or cyclist wander into a pre-set danger zone down the side or at the back of the vehicle depending on where the cameras are installed. It will also alert the driver via a beeper on a display mounted on the A pillar inside the cabin. The 2 camera images can also be displayed on a dash or roof mounted monitor in the cab for additional Driver assistance.

I do think it's great to have blind side detection - in some ways

But, now you have a driver who, instead of concentrating on the traffic and driving his HGV, now has two more things to look at, or more alarms that beep at him. I'm seriously not convinced that's a good idea in general.

The new bus I've been driving has various beepers that warn me about stuff and each time I have to look down at the dash to see what is beeping and why - the two main ones are speed - but the system in the bus generally has no idea of the speed limit, often confusing the 80 or 90 kmph with an adjoining road at 30 or 50
Then there's the beep to let me know I've gone onto a white line - can you imagine how often that goes off on twisty roads
There also appears to be one that says I'm too close on the right side to something - in theory that's useful but TBH, I fucking know I'm close !!! I'm often close on the inside because, oh yes, the roads are narrow and often lined with mountains

New fangled stuff with beeps and extra screens sounds great but -

Surely we should raise people that are less stupid?? Like the old thingy on FB - "the old car manuals used to have instructions for changing spark plugs or whatever; new ones say don't drink the contents of the battery"


I do think that people should be smarter - if you are following a vehicle indicating left but in the right lane, it isn't rock science to work out that a 10m, 13m, articulated vehicle etc is gonna use the whole road to take the turn - so don't fucking undertake !!!

(I had that first instance at a right turn the other day - 13m coach, indicating right but moved into a hatching/lined area in the centre of the road as the bus stop is at an angle of about 75 degrees to the road, so it's a bit tight to get the bus into the turn and at the bus stop. YUP - indicators worked, but still, the car immediately behind me started driving down the inside, luckily didn't get far before he realised I really was turning right. FFS)


How did humans get so stupid ???

[Dickyboy]

How did humans get so stupid ???

Dum & dummer was a prediction not a comedy?

[The Spin Doctor]

New fangled stuff with beeps and extra screens sounds great but -
.
.
How did humans get so stupid ???

Don't worry - I'm there with you.

[Horse]

Read it. I do ask myself, how many others would also see a bear instead of the wheely bin.??

So our brain makes up an image that our eyes look at. Some folk more accurately than others i would imagine. At least he saw something and knew it was there, unlike being invisible to driver's pulling out in front of us.

Seeing something is better than seeing nothing. Thought provoking it is Hoss.

@Dodgy69 Watch the first video (if you're lacking attention span, FF to 2:30 )
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