400 Trumpets...

[mangocrazy]

my 1936 500cc Rudge makes 45bhp

You sure?

I'm sure a race tuned Ulster might make 45. I'd be staggered if the council spec 500 made much more than 30bhp.

My 2014 500cc single doesn't make 30, but then it's only got 2 valves and the Rudge has four iirc?

You're forgetting that it's the Best Rudge of All Time

[Mr. Dazzle]

my 1936 500cc Rudge makes 45bhp

You sure?

I'm sure a race tuned Ulster might make 45. I'd be staggered if the council spec 500 made much more than 30bhp.

My 2014 500cc single doesn't make 30, but then it's only got 2 valves and the Rudge has four iirc?

Get a Cosworth in there! 90bhp 300cc single.

[KungFooBob]

You sure?

I'm sure a race tuned Ulster might make 45. I'd be staggered if the council spec 500 made much more than 30bhp.

My 2014 500cc single doesn't make 30, but then it's only got 2 valves and the Rudge has four iirc?

Get a Cosworth in there! 90bhp 300cc single.

No fanx, the brakes are barely adequate with 27bhp.

[JackyJoll]

my 1936 500cc Rudge makes 45bhp

You sure?

I'm sure a race tuned Ulster might make 45. I'd be staggered if the council spec 500 made much more than 30bhp.

My 2014 500cc single doesn't make 30, but then it's only got 2 valves and the Rudge has four iirc?

100 bhp/litre was something of a boast for the early 1950s Grands Prix-winning works Norton. That perspective makes me doubt that a road 1930s Rudge 500 makes 45 bhp.

[Mr. Dazzle]

100bhp/litre was the kind of figure people like Rolls-Royce talked about as "future advanced aero engine" performance in the 1930s!

[JackyJoll]

100bhp/litre was the kind of figure people like Rolls-Royce talked about as "future advanced aero engine" performance in the 1930s!

But they hadn’t met Potter.

[A_morti]

100bhp/litre was the kind of figure people like Rolls-Royce talked about as "future advanced aero engine" performance in the 1930s!

But they hadn’t met Potter.

I heard his LC weighs 135kg, too.

[KungFooBob]

This isn't a pick on Potter thread!

If it was someone would have mentioned his height by now.

[JackyJoll]

This isn't a pick on Potter thread!

If it was someone would have mentioned his height by now.

Has he got some now?

[Le_Fromage_Grande]

Superdreams weigh 175KG wet, how does it weigh more than a Superdream, it's about the same power as a 400 Superdream as well.

A 400 superdream was 171kg dry according to the manual, so when you see 175kg wet that's without fuel, so like for like with a full 14 litre tank, it'll be 185kg.

35hp back then when nobody had a Dyno versus 40hp now when every magazine can fact check you, may or may not be the same breed of pony.

Bike magazines don't really exist anymore, those that do might as well be written by the bike manufacturers advertising teams, long gone are the days of Bike do a group test between a Goldwing and a Fiat 127 - the Fiat won btw.

If anyone can get a genuine 40bhp out of a road legal 400 single I'd be surprised, full noise enduro DRZ400s make just under 40bhp, and they really are FULL NOISE and don't meet any emissions regulations.

[Supermofo]

Superdreams weigh 175KG wet, how does it weigh more than a Superdream, it's about the same power as a 400 Superdream as well.

A 400 superdream was 171kg dry according to the manual, so when you see 175kg wet that's without fuel, so like for like with a full 14 litre tank, it'll be 185kg.

35hp back then when nobody had a Dyno versus 40hp now when every magazine can fact check you, may or may not be the same breed of pony.

If anyone can get a genuine 40bhp out of a road legal 400 single I'd be surprised, full noise enduro DRZ400s make just under 40bhp, and they really are FULL NOISE and don't meet any emissions regulations.

Cycle world dyno'd a 390 Duke at a gnats bollock over 40. Think claimed is 44.

https://www.cycleworld.com/story/bikes/ ... dyno-test/

[mangocrazy]

If my Duke 690 can make 73 bhp, then I'm sure a 400 can reach 40bhp, no problem.

[Supermofo]

It seems to have managed to delete the usual advantages of owning a small bike, i.e. it's small and light, and all they've done is make a big bike with all the weight and size of a big bike, but a quarter of the power of a big bike.

Although the fashion now is for huge and heavy bikes, so perhaps I'm just very unfashionable.

I'd say that was it. A 40bhp bike doesn't need upside down forks, such wide wheels (I'm guessing) chunky looking this/that. But then people might avoid it thinking it looks like a small bike. I suspect people want big/premium looking. Then add in ABS/Cats etc and you end up with a fair amount of weight.

Best example of paired back on a road bike I can think of is the SDR200. Always fancied one of those, but suspect I'd look like I was riding a toddlers bike!

[MrLongbeard]

[ChrisW]

Quite a mix of premium & budget. And they look properly tiny, particularly the Speed when you see it being ridden, around 5:39.

https://youtu.be/apXzoMnlR8g?t=339

[KungFooBob]

In some of the up close bits they do look a bit 'budget'. I'll wait to see what the RRP is before forming a proper opinion.

[ChrisW]

The grips look like they're from an Airfix kit.

[KungFooBob]

The switch gear, m/c and levers all look quite low rent, but if it's cheap enough it's to be expected.

[ChrisW]

Yep, but the rest of the cockpit looks great, clocks included. In a macro sense they've really done a great job making baby big-Triumphs.

[The Spin Doctor]

Perhaps the factories have their finger on the pulse and realise that costs are too high for these silly big bhp things and they see a return to sensible motorcycling as regular transport, instead of ego massaging.

The collaboration was announced a decade ago, and it was originally going to be a 250... then it morphed to a 350 which was what was fully expected to appear just a couple of months back.

The bigger machine makes sense for Europe and India as it's closer to the A2 limit here, and motorcycles are rapidly moving from just being econo-transport to aspirational in India. Taking on RE at their game and building bigger and more powerful makes sense.

The only thing that might put me off is weight, my 1981 RD350LC makes 42bhp standard and is about 135kg with the lighter wheels I have on it, and my 1936 500cc Rudge makes 45bhp and weighs 130kg, so how is it that in 2023 Triumph are making a 400cc bike that makes <40bhp and weighs 180kg

That's the price - the apparently very competitive price to be announced - of using a lot of steel in the construction. I see a market for lightweight aftermarket parts coming to an auction store near you soon.