Sucidal Bikers :(

[Noggin]

Almost put this in the BMP thread, cos it did!!

We were out on the road today in the coach, four trainee drivers, out for a little under 7 hours. So lots of break time etc.

But FFS, some bikers do have a death wish over here. Maybe it's this bad in the UK now, but I don't remember it being this bad.


At one point I was turning left at a T-junction with traffic lights. I indicated left but had to hang right a bit to take the turn. I reckon the first thing I ever learnt on my Direct Access was to give long vehicles/heavy goods a lot of space at turns/roundabouts. And remember this bus is fully marked up with ECOLE all over it, so everyone can easily see that it's being driven by student drivers

Anyway, this big scooter thing pulls up next to me on my left FFS. Ok, it's me and I'm possibly a smidge more aware of the fuckwittery of some two wheelers (I am including cycles in the 'some'!! ). All was fine cos I could see him and whilst he was a bit slow off the lights, I made sure I was slower!!


One of my fellow students was driving up a twisty mountain road (same happened when another was driving down) and SOOOOO many bikers were on the white line. FFS, buses need more space, don't get so close to the white line folks (I know you all know this, I'm just so annoyed - lots of comments from the instructor about bikers )


The absolute worst was so very lucky.
I really don't think my fellow student saw this one until it was almost too late. Bloody lucky and fucking stupid.
Big roundabout, bus was going first right, needed a bit of room on the left to turn.
Luckily this driver had been having issues with roundabouts so was going slowly.
A big bike with some luggage, not a youngster riding.

He went on the left side of a bus turning right.

Ok so far (if he watches out for the back end swinging round).

Nope, not ok. Very very not ok.

He rode to the front of the bus and turned RIGHT in front of the bus - taking the same lane

Not just in front, barely inches to spare between the bike and the front of the bus as it was coming off the roundabout into the right turn, so kinda going left to make room to get around the inside of the turn FFS

Honestly, I don't know if the student hit the brake fast enough or if the instructor used the dual control - but seriously, Who in the FUCK would ever think that is a good idea ?????


We did have an issue with a car that tried to beat the bus onto a roundabout from another lane and got away with it cos the bus driver braked quite hard, but again WTAF!!



I've never realised how mad people are around big vehicles

[Bustaspoke]

As a now retired trucker I can assure you that there are plenty of fckwits on motorcycles this side of the channel.You don't see as many,presumabley they don't survive as long as their 4 wheel bretheren but they're out there.
The aim is not to get involved in their accident unless you fancy earning overtime filling out paperwork,you get a bit calous & cold after a while

[Felix]

Coming home yesterday on a straight 60mph road. Large line of cars, vans coming the opposite direction. Bike pulls out to pass them all while i was still coming down. Two fucking car length he miss judged. Had i not been driving in the kerb the thick little shit would have been on my lap. Prick had the cheek to give a wave. Bikers, think they own the road

[Rockburner]

I'd lay down good money that we've all caused similar reactions at some point from someone.

[Scootabout]

Hard to know whether it's ignorance of the risk being run, or an assumption that there's always time to get past the big, slow bus/truck. I suppose that amounts to the same thing.

[Noggin]

I'd lay down good money that we've all caused similar reactions at some point from someone.

Oh I’m sure. But I can honestly say I’ve never taken that much of the piss with something the size of a bus or truck!

I know people think I over take where I shouldn’t, but I don’t, haven’t, wouldn’t overtake a moving heavy vehicle through a junction/roundabout!! Despite how it may seem I do really want to live!!

Most comments I’ve had are about filtering or that they don’t think I have the space to complete and overtake. Filtering cos, I guess, people don’t see bikes. But equally when I do it I do keep a very good eye on gaps and the wheels either side of the white line (always amazing how many will move closer to the white line to stop a bike going through!). But not over here cos filtering is illegal

I also don’t often react to bikes doing stupid stuff cos unless you’re on a bike at the same time in the same place, you really can’t see what they can see so can’t really say they shouldn’t. But arguing with the front of a bus on the exit of a roundabout is so asking for trouble!!


I honestly can say I’ve never pulled a stunt like the guy on the bike at the roundabout. That just made everything else BMP more cos I was so horrified (hence the list ) - how he didn’t end up under the front of the bus I’ll never know. I was as close to the front as a seated passenger can get - he was fucking lucky!!

[Noggin]

As a now retired trucker I can assure you that there are plenty of fckwits on motorcycles this side of the channel.You don't see as many,presumabley they don't survive as long as their 4 wheel bretheren but they're out there.
The aim is not to get involved in their accident unless you fancy earning overtime filling out paperwork,you get a bit calous & cold after a while

It’s definitely a different perspective! I’ve always thought everyone should have to do some time on a scooter or motorbike to appreciate how most riders are and why they act the way they do. And, over the years of talking to mates about driving and their reactions to big vehicles, the lack of understanding etc, I think everyone should do some time in a truck or bus. Something long enough to be awkward to manœuvre!!

I was lucky growing up as I learnt to drive on a farm. Then I drove 7.5 ton vehicles sometimes and my SDad spent a lot of time driving various sized trucks (having driven tractors and trailers) so talking to him and being open to learning meant that I possibly have always had more appreciation than most I knew, especially in the formative years of driving!

I got to do a ‘driving day’ with a company. Worked for one that included skid pan, buses and artics - maybe a day doing that would help people?!! The skid pan certainly saved me from an accident in a car within six months!!

Of course that’s not ‘manageable’ and would have to be voluntary. But I’m certainly planning to pay for my niece and nephew to do a session or half day on a skid pan cos it’ll help with understanding, and they may well end up driving out here at some point, so that will be a training never wasted!!

[DefTrap]

I'm generally critical of motorcyclist road positioning on the continent. Typically there's lots of hanging around too long in bigger vehicle's blind spots, often followed by really casual overtaking. You really don't want to be spending minutes hanging around in blind spots.

I tend to think if they concentrated more on self preservation and less on the incessant footwaving thank yous, when they actually do make themselves visible enough for you to see them and move aside, that there'd be fewer nasty incidents.

[Bustaspoke]

But not over here cos filtering is illegal

I never knew that & I've done a few thousand KM's around France Every day's a school day..

[Noggin]

But not over here cos filtering is illegal

I never knew that & I've done a few thousand KM's around France Every day's a school day..

I haven't checked The Code TBF!! But I've been told by everyone (bikers and non bikers) that you aren't allowed to actually filter.

However if cars move over and you can overtake on your side, that's ok (or it seems to be cos everyone does it!! You're not supposed to cross the centre line in the face of on coming traffic!)


They trialed filtering being allowed around Grenoble (and a couple of other places, but it was mostly for motorways I think) and put a very low speed limit on the bike that filtered and you had to have hazards on. The people that decide stopped the trial and it's not allowed still.


But I don't think overtaking if a car pulls over is 'quite' classed as filtering.

Mind you, I do have The Code to hand, so when I start my revision, I'll have a look and report back!! LOL

[asmethurst99]

I’ve just had a week in southern Italy and Naples ….ffs

[DefTrap]

But not over here cos filtering is illegal

I spend way too much time on the Bordeaux ring road, which is generally chokka. If filtering is illegal, everyone's ignoring it.

[Noggin]

But not over here cos filtering is illegal

I spend way too much time on the Bordeaux ring road, which is generally chokka. If filtering is illegal, everyone's ignoring it.

Les Fronch ignore most road laws it seems!

I haven't checked, but have been told by a lot of french drivers/riders that it is. However, as you say - most do seem to ignore it

[Sadlonelygit]

Having spent 20+ years as a steering wheel attendant and currently drive a 7m moho, the level of 'gottagetinfrontery' whether europe or UK is scary. The amount of times I've been kamikaze passed by someone who just has to be in front of me, then immediately slow down!
Back in the days of chugging along the M4, quite often i'd pass the same car 3 or 4 times as they'd be sitting at 60, i'd roll past at 62, then they'd take umbrage and zip past, then slow back down to 60 etc etc until I got to the A419 usually.

[Sadlonelygit]

Oh, as for filtering

The practice is authorized on highways and two-carriageway roads separated by a central reservation and equipped with at least two lanes each, where the maximum authorized speed is greater than or equal to 70 km/h.
Traffic between lines of vehicles at a standstill or moving at a very low speed is practiced on the two lanes, having the same direction of movement, the most to the left of a roadway.
The lateral space between vehicles traveling on the two leftmost lanes of a roadway must be sufficient.
Filtering is practiced at a maximum speed of 50 km/h, with a differential of 30 km / h compared to other vehicles.
None of the traffic lanes on the road is under construction or covered with snow or ice.
Before traveling in inter-lanes, the driver warns other users of his intention.
Motorized two or three-wheelers must not force the passage.
It is forbidden for a filtering vehicle to overtake another filtering vehicle.
When traffic becomes more fluid and vehicles are traveling at more than 50 km/h on at least one of the two lanes, the two or three-wheeled motor vehicles must resume their place in the tracks

Simples

[Noggin]

That's interesting. That's exactly what was "trialed" and then stopped in Grenoble. Weird they wanted to trial it if it's already allowed!

Basically though - you can't filter at more than 50km/h. So, if the police can use the hard shoulder, you'll get told off for filtering (cos let's be reasonable, none of us filter at 30mph

[Scootabout]

"..Additionally, when filtering in slow-moving traffic, take care and keep your speed low." HWC rule 88.

Seems like in France it's the same - if only de facto.

[Noggin]

It is interesting tho, that I've been told by so many bikers and car drivers that filtering is not allowed - no comment about speed or anything, just illegal!!

I've not really been in a position that it's necessary TBF, I just do the overtakes on A roads where cars move over. But filtering through two lanes going the same way I've not had to do here yet!!

[Dickyboy]

I used to hitch a lot back in my youth, certainly gave me a healthy respect for HGVs and their like.

However many years ago I did succumb to the challenge a mate set of riding up between 2 HGVs whilst they jockey'd for position on a dual carriageway.... not an experience I'd ever repeat.

[Flux]

Recently drove on the Paris peripherique at 8pm, with 1 Lane closed for Olympic games traffic only, I was in an 8m motorhome towing a bike on a short transverse trailer. Parisiens on motos/scooters bring a whole new level to suicide biking! There must be some nasty accidents as I saw several very near misses and some spectacularly dumb riding.