The expected longevity of a new bike?

[cheb]

My first thought is that mechanicals, pistons etc, will be more easily got than electricals.

I've also wondered if there is a future business in generic reprogrammable ignition boxen. I'll cheerfully admit to not knowing much about it, but all it needs to do is make a spark at the correct time. That might be a bit of an understatement. The most electricly complicated bike I've owned was a CRM250AR.

[cheb]

Is the LC box engine specific?

[Mr. Dazzle]

Lots of bikes have a generically programmable ignition...where do you think the OEMs get em? The only slight downside is that you need factory level tools and software to work with them

The answer to the OPs question is money based really. My old boss was well into classic cars - goodwood level stuff - some of which have modern computer based systems. He also has a mid 90s F1 car with electronics on it.

You can get someone to build you a full wiring loom with all the sensors, controllers etc. it will just cost you a pretty penny. The same sorts of people will build one offs etc. for race cars and prototypes etc.

[David]

As above ...its the electronics that will kill cars....my X type was off the road for four months waiting for a fix....still not 100%.
The Honda CRV of SWMBO is on sorn as the abs has a valve/sensor that needs fixing....after three attempts to put a s/h one on it went to a specialist and came back with another fault....now we are waiting for a board that is coming from Poland...you can see how that's going.....
On the other hand my sixty year old bikes should be no real problem, even though one was from a production run of around 600.

[Jody]

I spoke to a KTM about getting new fuel tank for my 2006 model superduke. They only made that model for 2 years and KTM don't have any tanks left!

[Le_Fromage_Grande]

Generally manufacturers support vehicles for 10 years after they've finished production, but what they actually do is manufacture enough extra parts to cover predicted usage of those parts for 10 years, and once they've run out there needs to be a big demand for them to start manufacturing them again.

If you're going to buy an old bike it's best to buy something popular as people will make spares for it, for instance Wiseco still make pistons for 1972 Z1s, and Dynatek make ignitions that are cheaper and better than the originals for a lot of classic bikes, when I rebuilt my Z engine nearly all parts were available (Wiseco high compression 1170 pistons were half the price of Kawasaki pistons), but the cam chain is genuine Kawasaki (from Cradley Heath Kawasaki) it was the cheapest good quality cam chain available, it was only £48, the gaskets cost more.

But even for popular bikes some parts are scarce, 83/84 YPVS clocks and clock mountings are hard to find and fetch a lot of money in good condition.

[demographic]

I might be wrong but I can't think of modern bikes with production runs virtually unchanged for as long as for instance bikes from the 70s and 80s.
Now its possible that 3D printing will help remanufacture either parts or molds for parts and the need for demand for those parts might not need to be as high as traditional moldmaking.

Looking at my two bikes, the main problems with my oil cooled GSXR are fairing parts, it would be possible to make fibreglass molds but a faff to do in a homemade setting. Part of the reason a lot of oil cooled GSXR specials had no fairings.
I think thats part of the reason why a lot of the custom bikes Weeksy keeps posting pics of are missing sidepanels. Old sidepanels crack and fall to bits.
My KX is from such a long production run that most parts are interchangable to some extent from 88 to 2004 and almost all of the engine internals from 90 on fit straight in with no modifications.
Parts are still widely available from America cos they still desert raced them til 2004.
The main changes over the years have been to the suspension and many of them are the same more or less through the 500,250 and 125s of the same model years.

There are some electronic parts being made for em because even though they don't have much electronics as standard theres still enough about that people are modifying them.

Decent production runs also means theres decent bike specific forums to get concentrated information from, more general sites (like this one) are OK for a wide variety of info but you have to be fairly lucky to have someone give very specific technical answers on a particular model.

[Yorick]

Just buy 2 so you'll always have spares

[weeksy]

I don't see myself keeping any bike for even 3 years, let alone 20 of them! So in all reality, I don't care.

[Mr. Dazzle]

The huge reduction in cost and complexity of things like laser scanners, CAD software and 3D printers might actually make reverse engineering factory stuff more viable.

It wouldn't actually be that hard to make lots of spares if the factories would release drawings etc. for obsolete vehicles. They'll never do that for two big reasons though a) even old drawings would still contain a lot of IP and b) releasing factory information implies some sort of warranty or official stamp of approval. Even if they cover themselves with disclaimers they still stand to lose face when some idiot makes stuff badly when using their "instructions".

So you're left with reverse engineering...which is potentially becoming more viable.

[demographic]

The huge reduction in cost and complexity of things like laser scanners, CAD software and 3D printers might actually make reverse engineering factory stuff more viable.

It wouldn't actually be that hard to make lots of spares if the factories would release drawings etc. for obsolete vehicles. They'll never do that for two big reasons though a) even old drawings would still contain a lot of IP and b) releasing factory information implies some sort of warranty or official stamp of approval. Even if they cover themselves with disclaimers they still stand to lose face when some idiot makes stuff badly when using their "instructions".

So you're left with reverse engineering...which is potentially becoming more viable.

One of the UK based electric into classic car companies I watched on Youtube used a laser scanner to measure up the old car and see how to configure all sorts of modifications on a computer before throwing bits at it.
I think it was this episode but I'm not positive.

[Cousin Jack]

As above ...its the electronics that will kill cars...

My wife had a Merc A series, and it fried it's CPU and went into 'limp home' mode. Allegedly the new CPU had to be programmed by the factory to the specifics for that particular car. And of course the dealer got the VIN Number wrong when they ordered it......................

[Druid]

I don't see myself keeping any bike for even 3 years, let alone 20 of them! So in all reality, I don't care.

My bikes are typically 10-15 years old so I do care a bit. Consumables like filters, brake pads etc are readily available, you can even get an OE rear hub assembly for a 2010 MV Agusta Brutale but I've no idea if there are still stocks of more model specific and easily damaged parts available. I believe headlights are very hard to find now for example.

[KungFooBob]

Fairings.

If you've got a a sports bike made in the last 10-15 years you'll be be able to find a Chinese copy for not a massive amount of money.

If you have an 80s/90s VFR you're pretty fucked. It's you've got some thing exotic like a Bimota you're totally fucked.

[demographic]

Well, by the looks of it fibreglass parts might not be the problem I thought they would be.
Seems theres bits for ancient oil boilers after all.
https://www.airtech-streamlining.com/su ... .htm#price

[DefTrap]

It's surprising what goes obsolete. My auld 406 you can't buy a new brake servo for example , it's obsolete - for a vehicle model they must have made 100thou of. Of course 20 years later probably only 10% remain and even fewer of specific models. Of course you can still bodge on new parts from variant models, but you can't persuade a fecking main dealer to do it.

If I hadn't found a spare from a breaker in Bulgaria FFS then perhaps a perfectly good enough vehicle would have been scrapped. I bet it happens all the time.

[G.P]

Many moons ago I used to work for a Whiteware and (strangely) medical device manufacturing company. There was a policy that a a product should be supportable for a minimum number of years after the final unit was built (ISTR it was 10 years on appliances and longer on Med Devices).

The number took into consideration the total numbers built, the known profile of component failure of each item in the Bill of Materials and then overlaid the probable profile onto the maps of dealers and accredited repairers (this was pre widespread internet).

If a component has been upgraded during its life but was backward compatible it wouldn't get a new part number so would always carry the legacy of the unreliability of that part number throughout its life and there would be more of them in the spares supply chain.

So the way these numbers are dealt with in terms of manufacturing for spares demand means there is a wide variation of NOS in the supply chain from different manufacturers.

[demographic]

As above ...its the electronics that will kill cars...

My wife had a Merc A series, and it fried it's CPU and went into 'limp home' mode. Allegedly the new CPU had to be programmed by the factory to the specifics for that particular car. And of course the dealer got the VIN Number wrong when they ordered it......................

From what a few people have told me Mercs are known for having a bit of dead technology on them.
Possibly cos they have a lot of technology there in the first place?

Can't say I've been in enough to notice really.

[David]

My point rests yr onor....No modern tech means no modern tech up fux....

[demographic]

My point rests yr onor....No modern tech means no modern tech up fux....

Pretty much the reason I avoid tech I don't feel like I need on vehicles.
It's got to get me to and from work.

Oddly enough I can't wait for lecky vehicles to get a bit more mainstream cos theres less moving parts on them.
Mind Tesla does seem to be taking the piss with that idea cos you can't even use a frigging door handle til it pops out for you.