Grammar - what's this all about?

[Trogladyte]

Whys is it that in certain contexts people tend to omit the definite article with words that would normally demand it? I have often been struck by this, an have never quite worked out what's going on. Given that it is such common usage I think it is probably acceptable, but every time I hear it, my internal pedant grammar alarm goes off. So what's the deal? It's often in professional contexts, and in phrases dealing with location. Here are a few examples:

I was working on site
We don't have that in store today
Let's go back to camp
One of the other reps in resort told me

What's going on here? Why isn't it "the site" or "the resort"?

[Yambo]

Why is there a word for Q?

English has to be one of the most difficult languages to learn, especially if you are going to have to read and write it. Pronunciation in English is a nightmare. Leaving out a definite article is small beer really. There is no definite article in Turkish and probably many other languages. It's really not needed although some people may demand it is used.

[Dodgy69]

Whys is it that in certain contexts people tend to omit the definite article with words that would normally demand it? I have often been struck by this, an have never quite worked out what's going on. Given that it is such common usage I think it is probably acceptable, but every time I hear it, my internal pedant grammar alarm goes off. So what's the deal? It's often in professional contexts, and in phrases dealing with location. Here are a few examples:

I was working on site
We don't have that in store today
Let's go back to camp
One of the other reps in resort told me

What's going on here? Why isn't it "the site" or "the resort"?

It's a northern thing init.

[scottyuk]

"It's often in professional contexts, and in phrases dealing with location."

I hate seeing a comma before 'and'.

[Mr. Dazzle]

We also have it the other way around compared to some languages.

"It's raining" for example. What's raining?

[demographic]

Were you struggling to understand it?
If not then the way it was used works, language evolves and on the odd ocassion it loses its extraneous parts.
There's likely a quip about it's appendix to be had there somewhere.

[Trogladyte]

Were you struggling to understand it?
If not then the way it was used works, language evolves and on the odd ocassion it loses its extraneous parts.
There's likely a quip about it's appendix to be had there somewhere.

No, I understood it perfectly. And I am not someone who thinks that grammar prescribes linguistic usage; rather I think grammar describes the language. But I am intrigued by this usage, and would like to understand if there is any pattern to it, and whether it has any particular purpose, or nuance of meaning beyond some slight simplification by the jettisoning of the inessential.

[The Martian]

Whys is it that in certain contexts people tend to omit the definite article with words that would normally demand it? I have often been struck by this, an have never quite worked out what's going on. Given that it is such common usage I think it is probably acceptable, but every time I hear it, my internal pedant grammar alarm goes off. So what's the deal? It's often in professional contexts, and in phrases dealing with location. Here are a few examples:

I was working on site
We don't have that in store today
Let's go back to camp
One of the other reps in resort told me

What's going on here? Why isn't it "the site" or "the resort"?

Says you who can't spell "and"

[moth]

We also have it the other way around compared to some languages.

"It's raining" for example. What's raining?

it's raining - it is raining

No confusion there, raining is a verb.

What about

il pluet - it rains

[Horse]

Why is there a word for Q?

We have one for aitch, too.

[Mr. Dazzle]

We also have it the other way around compared to some languages.

"It's raining" for example. What's raining?

it's raining - it is raining

No confusion there, raining is a verb.

What about

il pluet - it rains

What is "it" in his context though?

[Horse]

I hate seeing a comma before 'and'.

A list of shops: Tesco, Lidl, Aldi and Marks and Spencer.

Makes more sense as: 'Tesco, Lidl, Aldi, and Marks and Spencer', doesn't it?

[moth]

We also have it the other way around compared to some languages.

"It's raining" for example. What's raining?

it's raining - it is raining

No confusion there, raining is a verb.

What about

il pluet - it rains

What is "it" in his context though?

Unless you're a complete moron, it describes the weather. Do you have a similar problem with 'it's sunny', 'it's windy' and 'it's foggy'?

[Mr. Dazzle]

So why not say "the weather is rainy?".

That's my point, english had dropped the word weather or whatever and just has "it".

Edit: I suppose a less clear cut example would be "it's beginning to feel a lot like Christmas". What is? We all know what you mean, but what is the "it"?

[moth]

So why not say "the weather is rainy?".

That's my point, english had dropped the word weather or whatever and just has "it".

The three European languages that I speak, with varying degrees of fluency, don't use the indicative 'weather' or the progressive 'is ....ing'. there are no 'ing' word endings in German, French or Spanish AFAIK

es regen, il pluet, esta lloviendo - it rains.

So tell the Germans, French and Spanish that they're fucking wrong too

Now, was this just the 10 minute argument, or did you pay for the whole 30 minutes? :p

[JackyJoll]

Fuck it!

http://www.english-for-students.com/It.html

[scottyuk]

I hate seeing a comma before 'and'.

A list of shops: Tesco, Lidl, Aldi and Marks and Spencer.

Makes more sense as: 'Tesco, Lidl, Aldi, and Marks and Spencer', doesn't it?

Personally, I would reorder it e.g. "Marks and Spencer, Tesco, Lidl and Aldi".
I do begrudgingly accept the Oxford comma but that's not applicable in the OP's post.
There are a few exceptions

[Yambo]

It has long been the case in UK that roadworks are done by "they" as in "They are digging up the road again, they only dug it up 3 months ago." Of course, nobody is really bothered who "they" are. It could be the council, the gas company, electric company or bank robbers, it doesn't really matter.

It's exactly the same here: "Onlar yapıyorlar."

Personally, I would reorder it e.g. "Marks and Spencer, Tesco, Lidl and Aldi".
I do begrudgingly accept the Oxford comma but that's not applicable in the OP's post.
There are a few exceptions

Alphabetical order would be better, of course.

[Saga Lout]

It has long been the case in UK that roadworks are done by "they" as in "They are digging up the road again, they only dug it up 3 months ago." Of course, nobody is really bothered who "they" are. It could be the council, the gas company, electric company or bank robbers, it doesn't really matter.

It's exactly the same here: "Onlar yapıyorlar."

Personally, I would reorder it e.g. "Marks and Spencer, Tesco, Lidl and Aldi".
I do begrudgingly accept the Oxford comma but that's not applicable in the OP's post.
There are a few exceptions

Alphabetical order would be better, of course.

Aldi, Lidl, Marks, Tesco and Spencer? That would be stupid.

[Yambo]

Aldi, Lidl, Marks, Tesco and Spencer? That would be stupid.

It certainly would if it was meant to be alphabetical order!