Count Steer wrote: ↑Wed Nov 22, 2023 2:09 pm
Paid for from increased tax take. (Freezing income tax levels and removing freeze on fuel duty and putting it on an inflation escalator). The govt. giveth, the govt. taketh away.
That's the problem, a bloody expensive and inefficient way to give you (some of) your own money back!
Small Government, low tax, take responsibility for yourself, is IMO the way to go.
Count Steer wrote: ↑Wed Nov 22, 2023 2:09 pm
Paid for from increased tax take. (Freezing income tax levels and removing freeze on fuel duty and putting it on an inflation escalator). The govt. giveth, the govt. taketh away.
That's the problem, a bloody expensive and inefficient way to give you (some of) your own money back!
Small Government, low tax, take responsibility for yourself, is IMO the way to go.
Pensions up by ~£50/month will help fund all those operations that have to get done privately. Spire etc will be pleased.
Doubt is not a pleasant condition.
But certainty is an absurd one.
Voltaire
Count Steer wrote: ↑Wed Nov 22, 2023 2:09 pm
Paid for from increased tax take. (Freezing income tax levels and removing freeze on fuel duty and putting it on an inflation escalator). The govt. giveth, the govt. taketh away.
Small Government, low tax, take responsibility for yourself, is IMO the way to go.
The trouble is that most of the UK population would view that with horror. They won't even stop shoving cream cakes and Greggs down their necks, let alone any sort if fiscal responsibility
Count Steer wrote: ↑Wed Nov 22, 2023 2:09 pm
Paid for from increased tax take. (Freezing income tax levels and removing freeze on fuel duty and putting it on an inflation escalator). The govt. giveth, the govt. taketh away.
Small Government, low tax, take responsibility for yourself, is IMO the way to go.
The trouble is that most of the UK population would view that with horror. They won't even stop shoving cream cakes and Greggs down their necks, let alone any sort if fiscal responsibility
It's an interesting one. The tax take as a % of GDP in Germany, France, Italy, Canada, Sweden etc is higher than here (38%) and some of them like their cake (not sure what the Greggs equivalent is in those places ). I suspect the issue isn't high taxes, it's spaffed taxes. Ask the Berliners (jam doughnuts...which is a sort of cake ) what they think of tax levels this weekend?
Doubt is not a pleasant condition.
But certainty is an absurd one.
Voltaire
Mr Moofo wrote: ↑Wed Nov 22, 2023 3:38 pm
[quote="Cousin Jack" post_id=279607 time=1700662783 user_id=107
Small Government, low tax, take responsibility for yourself, is IMO the way to go.
The trouble is that most of the UK population would view that with horror. They won't even stop shoving cream cakes and Greggs down their necks, let alone any sort if fiscal responsibility
[/quote]
True, so get them used to it now, while some sort of safety net can still exist. The way assorted Governments are going we will eventually get to the stage where inflation is rampant, the £ is worth diddly-squat and we are in DEEP shit. Then everyone will have to sort themselves out as best they can, and no safety nets will be available.
The Government is not your nanny, and your human rights do not extend to housing, clothing and feeding you.
Potter wrote: ↑Wed Nov 22, 2023 4:06 pm
I pay voluntary NI and I have done for about twenty years now, never used an NHS hospital or unemployment benefits though.
I paid NI and pay income tax too - and when I was your age I hadn't used either of them either. (Well I was born in an NHS hospital and needed their services after an RTA when I was 16 or 17). I pay taxes in the hope in the hope that the people around me are healthy, educated, employed and not crims. It's not working out so well.
Doubt is not a pleasant condition.
But certainty is an absurd one.
Voltaire
Small Government, low tax, take responsibility for yourself, is IMO the way to go.
The trouble is that most of the UK population would view that with horror. They won't even stop shoving cream cakes and Greggs down their necks, let alone any sort if fiscal responsibility
It's an interesting one. The tax take as a % of GDP in Germany, France, Italy, Canada, Sweden etc is higher than here (38%) and some of them like their cake (not sure what the Greggs equivalent is in those places ). I suspect the issue isn't high taxes, it's spaffed taxes. Ask the Berliners (jam doughnuts...which is a sort of cake ) what they think of tax levels this weekend?
Having lived in Germany I understand the taxation . Medical insurance appearing on your salary slip helped most of the Germans not be slobs.
The Berliners however are well subsidised by the rest of (West) Germany. They are seen to get plenty of tax money and whine a lot.
The trouble is that most of the UK population would view that with horror. They won't even stop shoving cream cakes and Greggs down their necks, let alone any sort if fiscal responsibility
It's an interesting one. The tax take as a % of GDP in Germany, France, Italy, Canada, Sweden etc is higher than here (38%) and some of them like their cake (not sure what the Greggs equivalent is in those places ). I suspect the issue isn't high taxes, it's spaffed taxes. Ask the Berliners (jam doughnuts...which is a sort of cake ) what they think of tax levels this weekend?
Having lived in Germany I understand the taxation .
I lived in Belgium...and I've no idea about their tax! I remember someone in our Hamsterjam office showing me what I think was their tax bill and it had their utility charges on it but it may have been something like our Council Tax bill as iirc their local authorities were also their gas/electric supply company (and they couldn't switch).
Doubt is not a pleasant condition.
But certainty is an absurd one.
Voltaire
AMSTERDAM, Nov 22 (Reuters) - Dutch anti-EU far-right populist Geert Wilders, who has vowed to halt all immigration to the Netherlands, was set for a major victory in parliamentary elections on Wednesday, an exit poll showed.
Beating all predictions, the exit poll put Wilders' Freedom Party (PVV) at 35 out of 150 seats, 10 seats ahead of the closest rival, former EU Commissioner Frans Timmermans' Labour/Green Left combination. That margin was far greater than expected.
"Truth does not change because it is, or is not, believed by a majority of the people." - Giordano Bruno
AMSTERDAM, Nov 22 (Reuters) - Dutch anti-EU far-right populist Geert Wilders, who has vowed to halt all immigration to the Netherlands, was set for a major victory in parliamentary elections on Wednesday, an exit poll showed.
Beating all predictions, the exit poll put Wilders' Freedom Party (PVV) at 35 out of 150 seats, 10 seats ahead of the closest rival, former EU Commissioner Frans Timmermans' Labour/Green Left combination. That margin was far greater than expected.
He’ll need a coalition with parties that might not let him do much.
AMSTERDAM, Nov 22 (Reuters) - Dutch anti-EU far-right populist Geert Wilders, who has vowed to halt all immigration to the Netherlands, was set for a major victory in parliamentary elections on Wednesday, an exit poll showed.
Beating all predictions, the exit poll put Wilders' Freedom Party (PVV) at 35 out of 150 seats, 10 seats ahead of the closest rival, former EU Commissioner Frans Timmermans' Labour/Green Left combination. That margin was far greater than expected.
He’ll need a coalition with parties that might not let him do much.
Any party that refuses to go into a coalition government would be quite clearly ignoring a huge upswell of public opinion. They would simply be saying "We don't give a shit about what the public actually want!"
Lots of people want change, and not just in the Netherlands.
JackyJoll wrote: ↑Wed Nov 22, 2023 11:00 pm
He’ll need a coalition with parties that might not let him do much.
Any party that refuses to go into a coalition government would be quite clearly ignoring a huge upswell of public opinion. They would simply be saying "We don't give a shit about what the public actually want!"
Lots of people want change, and not just in the Netherlands.
Let's not go wild here. They won 35 out of 150 seats so that's 115 seats for the 'not Geert Wilders' party. They're not a majority representing the country by any stretch of the imagination. If I'd voted for a less right wing party (like the majority of them did) I'd be pretty miffed if they hopped into the political bed with them.
Doubt is not a pleasant condition.
But certainty is an absurd one.
Voltaire
AMSTERDAM, Nov 22 (Reuters) - Dutch anti-EU far-right populist Geert Wilders, who has vowed to halt all immigration to the Netherlands, was set for a major victory in parliamentary elections on Wednesday, an exit poll showed.
Beating all predictions, the exit poll put Wilders' Freedom Party (PVV) at 35 out of 150 seats, 10 seats ahead of the closest rival, former EU Commissioner Frans Timmermans' Labour/Green Left combination. That margin was far greater than expected.
He’ll need a coalition with parties that might not let him do much.
Freezing out/ignoring what a significant proportion of what the electorate have voted for is ultimately counter productive.
Net migration into the UK in 2022 was ~600,000. Given that Birmingham, depending how you choose to define it, has a pipulation of about 1.2m, that's 5 cities the size of Birmingham created every decade.
UK politicians who ignore the socio/economic issues created by this level of immigration do so at their peril. The Netherlands is an early warning.
"Truth does not change because it is, or is not, believed by a majority of the people." - Giordano Bruno
JackyJoll wrote: ↑Wed Nov 22, 2023 11:00 pm
He’ll need a coalition with parties that might not let him do much.
Any party that refuses to go into a coalition government would be quite clearly ignoring a huge upswell of public opinion. They would simply be saying "We don't give a shit about what the public actually want!"
Lots of people want change, and not just in the Netherlands.
Let's not go wild here. They won 35 out of 150 seats so that's 115 seats for the 'not Geert Wilders' party. They're not a majority representing the country by any stretch of the imagination. If I'd voted for a less right wing party (like the majority of them did) I'd be pretty miffed if they hopped into the political bed with them.
Interesting that those wishing to increase controls on immigration are labelled (smeared) "right wing" by "the left".
"Truth does not change because it is, or is not, believed by a majority of the people." - Giordano Bruno
Inflation is going down, whilst the price of things goes up.
They're clever people to be able to manage that.
It's easy if you get your definitions right.
Last month yer average basket went up by a £. This month yer average basket went up by 50p
Inflation has fallen by 50%
But yer average basket costs £1.50 more than it did at the start of last month.
And if that little trick starts getting tired we can always rebalance yer basket. You stopped buying jam because you can't afford it, so we will take jam out of the basket and use the price of marge instead.
Inflation is going down, whilst the price of things goes up.
They're clever people to be able to manage that.
It's easy if you get your definitions right.
Last month yer average basket went up by a £. This month yer average basket went up by 50p
Inflation has fallen by 50%
But yer average basket costs £1.50 more than it did at the start of last month.
And if that little trick starts getting tired we can always rebalance yer basket. You stopped buying jam because you can't afford it, so we will take jam out of the basket and use the price of marge instead.
Surely it will be "plant butter". Marge is so 1990's.
Inflation is going down, whilst the price of things goes up.
They're clever people to be able to manage that.
It's easy if you get your definitions right.
Last month yer average basket went up by a £. This month yer average basket went up by 50p
Inflation has fallen by 50%
But yer average basket costs £1.50 more than it did at the start of last month.
And if that little trick starts getting tired we can always rebalance yer basket. You stopped buying jam because you can't afford it, so we will take jam out of the basket and use the price of marge instead.
You're right.Perhaps if announcements by government or media referred to the rate of inflation, there may be more understanding of the truth. Similarly, with the energy price caps, at first, the media (and perhaps the politicians) spoke about it, saying it's capped at, say £1800p.pa. leaving some questioning why they were paying more. Rarely did they mention it's the unit price that's capped. Now they are making it a bit clearer that this is an average and won't be the same cost for every household.
I'm not suggesting anyone here misunderstood the reality but I can see why some members of the public would, depending from where they got their information.
Inflation is going down, whilst the price of things goes up.
They're clever people to be able to manage that.
It's easy if you get your definitions right.
Last month yer average basket went up by a £. This month yer average basket went up by 50p
Inflation has fallen by 50%
But yer average basket costs £1.50 more than it did at the start of last month.
And if that little trick starts getting tired we can always rebalance yer basket. You stopped buying jam because you can't afford it, so we will take jam out of the basket and use the price of marge instead.
Surely it will be "plant butter". Marge is so 1990's.
Potter wrote: ↑Thu Nov 23, 2023 9:13 am
That must be a properly unpleasant way to die, I've read that the cold switches you off pretty quickly and I would imagine the sheer terror of being thrown into the ocean like that probably releases so much adrenaline that it's perhaps over before you suffer that much, but it's got to be horrible.
Drowning is often and pretty much misunderstood.
A person in the water screaming and shouting isn't drowning; they may be in distress but they're not drowning. Kids drowning in swimming pools for example do it quietly and often unnoticed.
Inflation is going down, whilst the price of things goes up.
They're clever people to be able to manage that.
It's easy if you get your definitions right.
Last month yer average basket went up by a £. This month yer average basket went up by 50p
Inflation has fallen by 50%
But yer average basket costs £1.50 more than it did at the start of last month.
And if that little trick starts getting tired we can always rebalance yer basket. You stopped buying jam because you can't afford it, so we will take jam out of the basket and use the price of marge instead.
That is low-priced spread (explaining for any left-wing activists here).
). I suspect the issue isn't high taxes, it's spaffed taxes. Ask the Berliners (jam doughnuts...which is a sort of cake 
) what they think of tax levels this weekend? 
I remember someone in our Hamsterjam office showing me what I think was their tax bill and it had their utility charges on it but it may have been something like our Council Tax bill as iirc their local authorities were also their gas/electric supply company (and they couldn't switch).
