revtothelimit - motorbike forum

MrLongbeard wrote: Mon Jun 23, 2025 5:58 pm

mangocrazy wrote: Mon Jun 23, 2025 4:37 pm Just re-watched the first few minutes of the vid and the rings are for Toyota models but are in fact made by Goetze, so not OEM. But Goetze manufacture 'to OEM standards' so that's all right...

No wonder I missed it.
You have to, or at least I do, have to ask to what extent is this reduction in tension down to materials being downgraded by 3rd party suppliers to save money in addition to / instead of OEM materials specs.

Hard to tell, unless you could do a rigorous A/B test with OEM vs. non OEM. My money is on Goetze conforming to Toyota's design parameters. They've been in business since 1887 (way before Toyota) so they're hardly some Johnny-come-lately Chinese outfit. YMMV, of course.

I thought most major car manufacturers are, basically, assembly lines of parts made by 3rd party suppliers anyway. (Parts generally made to their design and specs of course although many may be 'off-the-shelf'). I suppose Goetze could be (one of) their piston ring suppliers so well able to make to OEM standard/spec?


(As an aside, car manufacturers suffered a production drop when the Russians invaded Ukraine as lots of car wiring looms are produced there. So big networks of makers in complicated supply chains that sometimes have their resilience tested!).

Count Steer wrote: Mon Jun 23, 2025 7:29 pm I thought most major car manufacturers are, basically, assembly lines of parts made by 3rd party suppliers anyway.

And often from the same factory manufacturing for different marques.

A mate worked for a plastic moulding company. Interior door handles, etc

He told of differing attitudes to quality from clients, ranging from careful checking to 'throw them in a bucket'.

Count Steer wrote: Mon Jun 23, 2025 7:29 pm I suppose Goetze could be (one of) their piston ring suppliers so well able to make to OEM standard/spec?

They could well be.

One reason OEM branded parts are more expensive is because they have to take on the warranty risk of it going wrong, plus the associated reputation risk. They also typically have much longer spares availability life, 20 or 30 years.

Goetze also wouldn't be able to just put the Toyota parts in a bag which doesn't say Toyota. If Toyota paid them to develop it, Goetze can't just sell it themselves too.

Well probably fairer to say they shouldn't, but some suppliers are more scrupulous than others.

I hadn't realised piston rings are made as a continuous coil and then cut to length. Uncut they look like a giant slinky.

cheb wrote: Tue Jun 24, 2025 6:46 am I hadn't realised piston rings are made as a continuous coil and then cut to length. Uncut they look like a giant slinky.

Makes sense - they're essentially a portion of a spring, so it's logical they might be made that way.


(reminds me - I ought to order new rings for the JAP.... )

Not watched the video, but does thinner oil also not help the issue? I note that whilst Mrs Supermofo's Mazda has a very similar engine to mine (hers is newer and a mild H) mine uses 5/30 oil and hers 0/20, presumably for improved economy? Thinner oil + piston rings could = more oil use?

Not that her car uses any at all in the time we've owned it.

Rockburner wrote: Tue Jun 24, 2025 8:23 am

cheb wrote: Tue Jun 24, 2025 6:46 am I hadn't realised piston rings are made as a continuous coil and then cut to length. Uncut they look like a giant slinky.

Makes sense - they're essentially a portion of a spring, so it's logical they might be made that way.


(reminds me - I ought to order new rings for the JAP.... )

I honestly would have guessed they're made like springs, but cut off to the final length in process.

So make the wire cross section first, straight, then feed it in a machine which coils it into a spring shape, cutting to length as it goes.

Making one long one and cutting it up would seem odd, but maybe there's a reason.

Wonderful thing about steel BTW, you can bend and twist and stretch it all over the place and it behaves just fine.

MrLongbeard wrote: Tue Jun 17, 2025 10:42 pm An ICE using up to 1 litre of oil every 1000 miles has been the standard manufacturer cop out since for ever.

My 7.3l V8 diesel didn't use that much during a 6,000 oil change interval, in fact it was about a pint.

& oil analysis showed zero fuel in the oil.

Mention oil consumption to BMW M5 owners... They get Clint Eastwood eye..
Was discussing oil consumption with roomie one day, we pull into a gas station & there's some sap adding 2 quarts to his M5. From my observation over the years, it appears they check the oil every time they gas up. If you pull into a gas station & there's a car with the hood up (admittedly pretty rare), it's usually an M5.

Got £8k of warranty work done (exchange complete engine apart from cylinder head) because my Volvo V40 was using 1l of oil every 2000 miles, that was for a diesel if that makes any difference, oh & cars without a dipstick can eff right off