Mussels wrote: ↑Wed Mar 02, 2022 12:13 pm
So the IOC expect Ukrainians to compete against Russians?
I hope several countries withdraw and show it to be a shambles.
BBC wrote:Paralympic athletes from Russia and Belarus must compete as neutrals at the forthcoming Beijing 2022 Paralympic Winter Games.
A statement by the International Paralympic Committee says the athletes - who have already arrived in China - will compete under the Paralympic flag.
They will not be included in the medal table, the IPC said.
The IPC said it had taken "the strongest possible actions" within the parameters available to them.
The Paralympics opens on Friday, with competition beginning on Saturday.
Twenty Ukrainian athletes are en route to the games, but it is thought they may choose to withdraw rather than compete against Russian and Belarusian athletes.
I can't decide how I feel about this
1 - Russia should be banned for all the reasons . . .
2 - the Russian para-althletes haven't waged war, probably have no interest in their country doing that but have no say and HAVE spent years training to get to the point of competing in the paraolympics
I think I would be more up for a full ban if it was the normal olympics. Maybe. But paraolympics, I don't know. I can't explain or put it into words very well
If I was a Ukrainian athlete, I'd want to compete and sodding well beat the Russians!!
Life is for living. Buy the shoes. Eat the cake. Ride the bikes. Just, ride the bikes!!
Interesting comparison tonight of Russian coverage of the war compared to outside coverage through internet uploads of live footage and other sources as i watched the Sky Documentary "Chernobyl, the Lost tapes" which was completely compiled from footage previously filmed and therefore classified by the former USSR.
Following the explosion state tv said there was nothing to worry about etc etc ......massed ranks of 1000's of personnel referred to as "Liquidators" brought in to carry out the clear up who were all hailed as heroes of the Soviet Union. They then showed declassified footage of many of those in treatment for radiation which estimate since then 80% died from radiation exposure, some of those with large exposure died horrifically.
State sources blamed all symptoms of radiation sickness as psychological and called it "Radiophobia". They tried the management in a public show trial and blamed them for the explosion despite all the evidence shows faulty construction and design
Once Gorbachev was pushed aside/resigned/stepped down for health reasons amid rioting among the Soviet states the state admitted the design flaws caused the disaster and within months Ukraine (where Chernobyl is within the borders) voted for independence and added to uprisings in other states with Georgia among the forefront the USSR collapsed
The official state death toll for Chernobyl was 31, mainly among the technicians on site at the time and the first responder fireman who attended and a helicopter crew who hit a crane while depositing Boron and sand into the active hole in the reactor. The estimated death toll from outside experts in radiation and medicine related to those injuries was 200,000 which doesnt account for the many thousands born with conditions brought on by the radiation.
State TV in Russia is now broadcasting events in Ukraine along a similar fashion as the former USSR with "The special operation to liberate the oppressed people of Ukraine" and many older former USSR citizens have no comprehension of their government shelling cities and killing civilians because "they said they wouldnt do that as they will only hit military objectives to free the population"
Carry on with the thread , it was in my head having watched it tonight and having grown up as a yoof looking at the USSR and and its break up i never thought i would see the day when old school Soviet doctrine would come back again ............ i know some states like North Korea and China always will probably be along those lines but i thought Russia had gone past that, apparently not.
I did see tonight however Russian State sources have released figures saying that as of today 498 Russian personnel have been killed in the week long assault on Ukraine ............ for comparison the UK had 457 service personnel killed in 10 years fighting in Afhganistan to "free the population"
Docca wrote: ↑Thu Mar 03, 2022 7:36 am
I wonder if the Russians view the BBC as state media?
If course they do but so far the Uk state doesn't shut down local media outlets it doesn't like, I'm not sure how long that will last given recent years.
Noggin wrote: ↑Wed Mar 02, 2022 9:13 pm
I can't decide how I feel about this
1 - Russia should be banned for all the reasons . . .
2 - the Russian para-althletes haven't waged war, probably have no interest in their country doing that but have no say and HAVE spent years training to get to the point of competing in the paraolympics
I think I would be more up for a full ban if it was the normal olympics. Maybe. But paraolympics, I don't know. I can't explain or put it into words very well
If I was a Ukrainian athlete, I'd want to compete and sodding well beat the Russians!!
You can hide news but it's much harder to hide missing teams from the Olympics, people being told not much is happening will question why those teams are suddenly not appearing.
Docca wrote: ↑Thu Mar 03, 2022 7:36 am
I wonder if the Russians view the BBC as state media?
If course they do but so far the Uk state doesn't shut down local media outlets it doesn't like, I'm not sure how long that will last given recent years.
I can tell you first hand they do - and they do not believe that our stations are non-bias. And , of course, they are correct. But is is not to same extreme as the control on their media.
That said you could still access FB in Russia - but not in China. News can filter through - but is all honesty, nothing of FB is really news, just people opinions.
Mussels wrote: ↑Thu Mar 03, 2022 7:49 am
If course they do but so far the Uk state doesn't shut down local media outlets it doesn't like, I'm not sure how long that will last given recent years.
If you think that certain powers in the UK doesn't suppress news it doesn't like then they've done a brilliant job on you.
That was a typo on my part, it was meant to start 'Of course they do'
Last edited by Mussels on Thu Mar 03, 2022 9:08 am, edited 1 time in total.
An Englishman and a Russian discussing media:
English laughs and says ''All your media is state controlled and is just propaganda'.
Russian laughs even harder and says 'Yes, is true. But you believe yours'.
Doubt is not a pleasant condition.
But certainty is an absurd one.
Voltaire
Count Steer wrote: ↑Thu Mar 03, 2022 9:05 am
Don't know if this is apocryphal but -
An Englishman and a Russian discussing media:
English laughs and says ''All your media is state controlled and is just propaganda'.
Russian laughs even harder and says 'Yes, is true. But you believe yours'.
Of course the modern way is to selectively gather your truth yourself, hidden in plain sight on YouTube
Potter wrote: ↑Thu Mar 03, 2022 9:08 am
Some countries simply block news that they don't want you to know about.
Others twist it.
Others brainwash you to not believe it even if you do see it.
Others hide really bad news in plain sight knowing that you don't care until they want you to - like Jimmy Saville.
I'm not sure the government asked the media to cover up Saville, that was self interest on the part of the media.
Given the UAE's similar political setup as Russia and their open support for Russia and your peers getting rich from it I wouldn't be surprised if you have been bombarded with loads of subtle reasons Russians are the good guys.
Count Steer wrote: ↑Thu Mar 03, 2022 9:05 am
Don't know if this is apocryphal but -
An Englishman and a Russian discussing media:
English laughs and says ''All your media is state controlled and is just propaganda'.
Russian laughs even harder and says 'Yes, is true. But you believe yours'.
Of course the modern way is to selectively gather your truth yourself, hidden in plain sight on YouTube
Indeed. The idea that anything that contradicts baked in views is 'fake news' is the new normal. People will happily believe QAnon's level of 'London bus found on moon' information if it fits with their personal insanity. Similarly, if I mention Bellingcat, someone will accuse it of being a CIA operation. The great debunker, Snopes, was accused of being some sort of disinformation bureau on here recently.
So, if people can't believe anything they see or hear, there is no 'truth' - where do we go from there? To a point where than can be no point in discussion? Lo! Here we are. (Back at Jimmy Savile ).
Doubt is not a pleasant condition.
But certainty is an absurd one.
Voltaire
Potter wrote: ↑Thu Mar 03, 2022 3:03 am
And they now have a lawless country run by gangs and warlords.
As they were before we started, and have been since the Middle Ages.
The recent problems with Afghanistan started after WW2, when US aid tried to help by building irrigation projects. That upset the balance of power between assorted warlords based on water rights that had taken a century to stabilize. Left alone they will no doubt sort out their own solution to their problems in 100 years or so. Will they be left alone, or will someone else try to 'help'?
).
