Pfizer vaccine approved

[weeksy]

Remember on VD when I was an equally annoying person when the argument came in favour of euthanising disabled babies.
Sometimes it's worth making a point.

Nope, i don't recall.

[slowsider]

Scary stuff eh.

Even with all those decades of information that smoking can lead to horrible disease and death, and all the effort, they've only cut the amount of people that smoke by a small percentage.

But you're arguing they shouldn't enforce vaccination - so presumably you support them not banning smoking? People's inability to limit damaging their own health supports the point in favour.

[weeksy]

But you're arguing they shouldn't enforce vaccination - so presumably you support them not banning smoking? People's inability to limit damaging their own health supports the point in favour.

Agreed.

But if we're doing enforcement then I'd choose to ban smoking and alcohol before covid.

The difference is, that both of them were a choice. Covid isn't and never has been and never arguably will be. Both drinking and smoking, someone at some stage has chosen to both partake and continue to do so.

[weeksy]

Nope, i don't recall.

If me suggesting that politics and religion shouldn't be given a forum means I can't argue my point on any other subject then you only have to say and I'll stay out of this section as well.

Argue your point all you like, just don't expect people not to pull you up on it when you're doing basically the same thing as you accused others of doing.

[Nidge]

I get that you’re playing devils advocate but maybe not everyone’s quite as poorly informed as you seem to be suggesting, putting yourself in the self-appointed position of educator to the thickies is only going to further polarise the debate IMO

Also, as soon as smoking and alcoholism are contagious I’ll be the first to agree they should be targeted with the same level of zeal

[weeksy]

I'm being careful now

Don't be, you crack on.

[weeksy]

Argue your point all you like, just don't expect people not to pull you up on it when you're doing basically the same thing as you accused others of doing.

I'm engaged in the debate and I assumed the others were as well.
If I'm being reported for it then as I said let me know and I'll drop it.

I keep getting accused of trolling but I've not made anything up at all, I didn't have a problem with the general news bit of the other section, just the politics that seemed to lead to a lot of bad feeling. I don't see it here, but like I said, if I'm pissing people off then it only needs a nod and I'll wind it in.

No-one said you were being reported fella. You just seem to be trying to cause an argument. I'd expect the only one you're irritating here is me, but that's mostly because i'm sadly having to enter a thread i'd rather not bother with just in case it all gets a bit ranty...

Arguably better if i stay out of it and only open if someone reports anything

[Yorick]

I get that you’re playing devils advocate but maybe not everyone’s quite as poorly informed as you seem to be suggesting, putting yourself in the self-appointed position of educator to the thickies is only going to further polarise the debate IMO

Can you point out the thickies, just so we know

[Gedge]

Scary stuff eh.

Even with all those decades of information that smoking can lead to horrible disease and death, and all the effort, they've only cut the amount of people that smoke by a small percentage.

Alcohol abuse is still fat.

[Charlie Sheen on] ...winning... [Charlie Sheen off]

No need for covid vaccines if you're happy 'winning' with reductions of just a few percent.

86% of adults NOT smoking is a pretty good statistic ...especially when you look back a bit further ,

Number of adult smokers
The highest recorded level of smoking among men in Great Britain was 82% in 1948, of whom 65% smoked manufactured cigarettes. At that time, significant numbers of men smoked pipes or cigars as well as, or instead of, manufactured cigarettes. By contrast, women have tended to smoke only cigarettes. Smoking prevalence among women in 1948 was 41% and remained fairly constant until the early 1970’s, peaking at 45% in the mid 1960’s.1

[Wreckless Rat]

[baits up fresh hook]

This is the same Harry, who is really pleased at the draconian measures in a certain country, because it means there is little in the way of things like muggings, robbery, drunkards etc

[/baits up fresh hook]

[Fresh cast]

Waits

[/end cast]

[gremlin]

Can you point out the thickies, just so we know

You know what they say: if you enter a room and can't spot the thicky in 10 seconds, you're it.

[irie]

It must be grim, sitting there quivering in your slippers about going down to the pub in case you bump into someone that hasn't been vaccinated

It’s nothing to do with that, it’s about a civic responsibility to protect others and remove the restrictions that are blighting so many lives which in turn are leading to other health crises.

My work brings me in to contact with leading vaccinologists, epidemiologists and immunologists- it’s not an exaggeration to say some of the are the world experts at the top of the field. One aspect of modelling that is studied is “vaccine confidence” which, sadly, is at an all time low in Spain and some other European countries. This is factored into the likely impact of vaccine roll out. Unfortunately the 95% efficacy rates claimed by Pfizer assume 100% uptake, which of course will never happen, but we need a high uptake to realise the full societal benefits

Indeed it is.

An IPSOS survey found that 46pc of the French will refuse a jab, compared to Spain (36pc), Italy (35pc), Germany (30pc) and the UK (21pc).

I think the above came from the below survey.

https://www.ipsos.com/en/global-attitud ... tober-2020

[slowsider]

I get that you’re playing devils advocate but maybe not everyone’s quite as poorly informed as you seem to be suggesting, putting yourself in the self-appointed position of educator to the thickies is only going to further polarise the debate IMO

Can you point out the thickies, just so we know

They're the ones asking to be pointed out.
Hth

[Asian Boss]

It's all thanks to Brexit, gawd bless it, anyway!...

Lovely, lovely Brexit. That's going so positively. Well done to all those who personally helped make it happen. We remember who you are.

[wheelnut]

Of course not, but it does put things into perspective. Shit yourself about a few hundred thousand being affected by covid but turn a blind eye to millions of lives ruined by the drugs sold on every high street.

I realise I’m nibbling on your hook (again), but the sad reality is that’s it not about the deaths. It’s about the ability of this particular strain of virus to overwhelm everything in its path simply by the ease of its transmission and maths. The disruption to our way of life, our health services, businesses and the economy would be even more catastrophic if left to run amok.

Like you say none of us gets of this alive, but I quite like my life (such as it lasts) and my freedom and if that means some mouth breathers need to be cajoled, blackmailed and threatened into not being idiots then so be it.

[wheelnut]

A lot of the people diagnosed with Aids in the 80s believed they only had a few years to live. They spent their savings and sold their assets. 30 years later and they're still around, fit and able but homeless and forgotten, suffering from depression.

There’s very few people, if any, that were HIV positive in the 80s that are alive now. Nowadays it’s a chronic condition that can be managed through a shit load of drugs. Back then, it was a death sentence, and a pretty swift one once the condition moved from HIV to the AIDS stage.

[DefTrap]

An IPSOS survey found that 46pc of the French will refuse a jab, compared to Spain (36pc), Italy (35pc), Germany (30pc) and the UK (21pc).

No I never.

But yay! Early vaccine for me.

FWIW my unbearable neighbour Fabrice - when he unavoidably collars me - is all over conspiracy theories and blah-blah Trump was robbed. Thrilled to find out he definitely isn't having a vaccine (because something about not trusting something or other 'suspicious'). Pretty much the only time his nonsense has made me smile.

[Saga Lout]

It’s nothing to do with that, it’s about a civic responsibility to protect others and remove the restrictions that are blighting so many lives which in turn are leading to other health crises.

My work brings me in to contact with leading vaccinologists, epidemiologists and immunologists- it’s not an exaggeration to say some of the are the world experts at the top of the field. One aspect of modelling that is studied is “vaccine confidence” which, sadly, is at an all time low in Spain and some other European countries. This is factored into the likely impact of vaccine roll out. Unfortunately the 95% efficacy rates claimed by Pfizer assume 100% uptake, which of course will never happen, but we need a high uptake to realise the full societal benefits

I will have the vaccine. Eventually. But when I do, it'll be to protect me, not to protect others, just like I have the flu vaccine every year to protect me. It's not up to me to protect others. Others can have the vaccine if they want to be protected. That's how vaccines work.

[Yorick]

I think our lovely island should only allow folk in who've had the vaccine. Currently we only allow folk in with a valid negative test.

I've had 2 pals fly back from UK in last week and both said some tossers tried to get on the plane without a valid certificate. All were kicked off the flight. And they all whined and argued like fuck about their human rights.

Our human rights say we don't want the selfish tossers here

[Mr. Dazzle]

It's not up to me to protect others.

Meh, just be glad not everyone feels that way.

I accept gift vouchers or cash by way of thanks BTW.