WSBK Jerez

[Yorick]

Nah. this crap has come up a lot in F1 this year too, dead easy to solve with absolutely no room for confusion / interpretation or anything.
Just bring back grass or bring the gravel run offs right to the edge of the kerb or make the kerbs super aggressive , they'll soon learn to keep off

Ed Zackerly.

[Yorick]

Rules should always enhance a sport. It shouldn't always be a case of blindly being right or wrong,black or white. There are times when consideration and judgement are necessary.

If this particular rule was changed from 'if you touch the paint on the last lap you get a penalty',to 'if you touch the paint on the last lap and gain a clear advantage you'll get a penalty'.Then the alteration would work with the entertainment spectacle and not interfere with the passion which gave us a great race.

If you touch the green paint, you have gained an advantage. It was grass before, so you would have crashed.
You pushed that bit extra, knowing you have a bit of a safety blanket.

If it becomes open to interpretation, every bugger will try it, hoping to get away with it

[Tricky]

As has already been said, absolutely brilliant racing and entertainment- that was proper hard-core racing by individuals at the top of their game

As for the result of race 2 , that was a shame for Toprak and Yamaha.
Yorick is either being deliberately argumentative or perhaps just a bit twp, who knows eh- Toprak didn't plan to go on the green.
Yep I'm sure he knew it was a risk that he might, but I'm also certain that he would have done what he could to not touch it - the reality as anyone who has tried to ride anywhere near their own limit will know, is that when you are riding that hard there's a fair bit of it in the lap of the gods and/or the actions of the people around you and it just simply isn't possible to rule out running off track, or crashing.

Anyway, yeah, rules is rules and I think everyone in this thread understands that, and that isn't what is being debated
FWIW I'm firmly with Skub and Wull on this and my view is that the competition is poorer for the rule not being written to give the ability for the race director to apply his/her discretion.

Roll on next season though eh, am really looking forward to it- I'm a bit meh about the rule changes, but there are some interesting seat changes, and of course Sam joining the party too

[Tricky]

And just to add a bit to the race 2 green-infringement debate, what do people think on what the penalties and race result would (and should?) have been if not just Toprak but Bautista and Aegerter all touched green on that last corner?

[Le_Fromage_Grande]

Nothing to do with racing, but was Wull referring to himself as "we", is he Gollum or Royalty?

[wull]

Nothing to do with racing, but was Wull referring to himself as "we", is he Gollum or Royalty?

[Timmy]

The football and tennis ananolgies don't stack up I'm afraid. The goal is given when all of the ball is over the line. The ball in tennis is called out when all of the ball is over the line. To my eyes, part of Toprak's tyre is still touching the kerb and should be counted as still being in contact with the track and he should be awarded the win. He wasn't though so I feel for him and how Bautista can claim the win and celebrate is beyond me.

[weeksy]

The football and tennis ananolgies don't stack up I'm afraid. The goal is given when all of the ball is over the line. The ball in tennis is called out when all of the ball is over the line.

The point is, that's the rules, that's been the rules all year and i think the year before. It doesn't matter that in different sports the rules are slightly different, the rules are still the rules... which was more my point.

We've seen the long lap penalty in MotoGP/2/3 and that's based upon exactly the same thing, but no-one is complaining it's unfair in those series ? The ruling is there, they're laid out and if you breach them, you get a penalty. You can't do the long lap as the race is over, therefore it's a 'different' penalty, but it's still laid out, set out and in stone... Can't for the life of me see how this is even a discussion.

[wull]

How can it not be a discussion? Are we not entitled to say that we (Skub etc) don’t agree with the rule and would like to see it implemented in a different way, taking other factors into consideration?

How many times do I have to say that we know the rules and that we know he broke them and that it’s clear his wheel was on the green, we haven’t disputed that at any point yet you keep going on about that, your stupid silly replies are only valid if we were actually disputing that which we aren’t yet you keep going on about that.

[weeksy]

How can it not be a discussion? Are we not entitled to say that we (Skub etc) don’t agree with the rule and would like to see it implemented in a different way, taking other factors into consideration?

How many times do I have to say that we know the rules and that we know he broke them and that it’s clear his wheel was on the green, we haven’t disputed that at any point yet you keep going on about that, your stupid silly replies are only valid if we were actually disputing that which we aren’t yet you keep going on about that.

So what's your actual point then ?

[wull]

How can it not be a discussion? Are we not entitled to say that we (Skub etc) don’t agree with the rule and would like to see it implemented in a different way, taking other factors into consideration?

How many times do I have to say that we know the rules and that we know he broke them and that it’s clear his wheel was on the green, we haven’t disputed that at any point yet you keep going on about that, your stupid silly replies are only valid if we were actually disputing that which we aren’t yet you keep going on about that.

So what's your actual point then ?

Holy fuck

[Yorick]

The MotoGP rules are very clear. I assume the WSBK ones are the same

Last Lap:
If you are closely fighting for a position and you go outside of track limits, you must show a disadvantage. "A rider that goes out must be in a worse-off position than the rider that stays on the track," said Webb. This is a decision from the MotoGP™ stewards. It is the stewards who enforce this and decide what the penalty will be.

"They will give a track limits penalty if there is clear evidence, a clear video image. To reinforce, we have high-speed cameras at all the trouble spots with image recognition software with people monitoring those cameras exclusively. It is very clear whether a bike is in or out."

Toprak knew what he'd done, and also knew the rules

[wull]

The MotoGP rules are very clear. I assume the WSBK ones are the same

Last Lap:
If you are closely fighting for a position and you go outside of track limits, you must show a disadvantage. "A rider that goes out must be in a worse-off position than the rider that stays on the track," said Webb. This is a decision from the MotoGP™ stewards. It is the stewards who enforce this and decide what the penalty will be.

"They will give a track limits penalty if there is clear evidence, a clear video image. To reinforce, we have high-speed cameras at all the trouble spots with image recognition software with people monitoring those cameras exclusively. It is very clear whether a bike is in or out."

Toprak knew what he'd done, and also knew the rules

[Yorick]

I saw a report yesterday that Taz McKenzie is in WSB next year?

Done bugger all this year, so he's got lucky

Well, he's riding in the Jerez test

Screenshot_20231031_144209_Samsung Internet.jpg (218.5 KiB) Viewed 294 times

[wull]

It’s mental to think winning a race is classed as doing bugger all.