revtothelimit - motorbike forum

The hub gears are fascinating, they're a real weird thing to get your head round

Hub gears, meh. My old man's raleigh had them back in the 50's.

Sturmey Archer have been making them for 100 years.

crust wrote: Mon Nov 16, 2020 6:19 pm Hub gears, meh. My old man's raleigh had them back in the 50's.

Sturmey Archer have been making them for 100 years.

Why are they so uncommon? You'd think if they can make one that's sealed, plus the same weight as a normal wheel + mech, they'd sell loads

weeksy wrote: Mon Nov 16, 2020 6:21 pm

crust wrote: Mon Nov 16, 2020 6:19 pm Hub gears, meh. My old man's raleigh had them back in the 50's.

Sturmey Archer have been making them for 100 years.

Why are they so uncommon? You'd think if they can make one that's sealed, plus the same weight as a normal wheel + mech, they'd sell loads

a Rohloff 14 speed hub is about a grand, what's a cassette & mech? being generous £150 unless you look at 12sp eagle cassettes

my understanding is that a rohloff is pretty complex to sevice compared to the mech although they should last a lot longer than a cassette. I rode a hub geared mtb a few years ago that had been badly serviced using the wrong oil and it was feckin awful but its replacement that work propper was a dream to use, changing gear while stationary was a bit peculiar

Taff wrote: Mon Nov 16, 2020 9:15 pm

weeksy wrote: Mon Nov 16, 2020 6:21 pm

crust wrote: Mon Nov 16, 2020 6:19 pm Hub gears, meh. My old man's raleigh had them back in the 50's.

Sturmey Archer have been making them for 100 years.

Why are they so uncommon? You'd think if they can make one that's sealed, plus the same weight as a normal wheel + mech, they'd sell loads

a Rohloff 14 speed hub is about a grand, what's a cassette & mech? being generous £150 unless you look at 12sp eagle cassettes

my understanding is that a rohloff is pretty complex to sevice compared to the mech although they should last a lot longer than a cassette. I rode a hub geared mtb a few years ago that had been badly serviced using the wrong oil and it was feckin awful but its replacement that work propper was a dream to use, changing gear while stationary was a bit peculiar

I hear you, but that's down in some way to smaller levels of production i expect. If Shimano/SRAM got into the market you'd think the price would fall massively and very quickly.

That Santa Cruz is hideously over biked for most UK riding which is a disappointment. My mates got the current Nomad as a frame replacement for his previous Mark version which suffered frame bb failure. He loved the ride of the old version but hates the new one as it’s just a bike park machine.

Oh and SRAM AXS gears are fantastic. Put 1000 miles on them this year and the chains still in spec and the cassette is looking good.

The problem is, that's where biking is going now, certainly with the younger generation and accesibility to bike parks, they don't want a carrera for shooting to see their mates, they want a full bouncer to head to Morzine. The more i ride in places like FoD, Swinley etc the more i see the kids (like mine) who just want to (and often are able to) send everything to the moon and back.

Rumour has it that SC will be releasing their version of the Levo SL soon which will hopefully be more sensible for XC/Trail.

weeksy wrote: Tue Nov 17, 2020 1:24 pm The problem is, that's where biking is going now, certainly with the younger generation and accesibility to bike parks, they don't want a carrera for shooting to see their mates, they want a full bouncer to head to Morzine. The more i ride in places like FoD, Swinley etc the more i see the kids (like mine) who just want to (and often are able to) send everything to the moon and back.

My son has my old Carrera to go to see his mates on, getting him out for a proper ride in the forest would involve threats and kidnapping

Julian_Boolean wrote: Tue Nov 17, 2020 3:05 pm

weeksy wrote: Tue Nov 17, 2020 1:24 pm The problem is, that's where biking is going now, certainly with the younger generation and accesibility to bike parks, they don't want a carrera for shooting to see their mates, they want a full bouncer to head to Morzine. The more i ride in places like FoD, Swinley etc the more i see the kids (like mine) who just want to (and often are able to) send everything to the moon and back.

My son has my old Carrera to go to see his mates on, getting him out for a proper ride in the forest would involve threats and kidnapping

Maybe my thoughts are clouded as my lad and all his close mates are very much into the crazy stuff.

https://www.pinkbike.com/news/first-loo ... bikes.html

Pinion gearbox based newly released bike.

That’s not a bad weight for a Pinion equipped full Sussex, it’s a Yes from me.

MingtheMerciless wrote: Thu Dec 24, 2020 7:03 am That’s not a bad weight for a Pinion equipped full Sussex, it’s a Yes from me.

Deffo has merit, bit worried about the tensioner and rock strikes though.

weeksy wrote: Tue Nov 17, 2020 8:40 am

Mate i usually ride with has just got one of these, well the frame, motor & battery, has almost built it now just waiting on some tyres to turn up.

weeksy wrote: Thu Dec 24, 2020 7:10 am

MingtheMerciless wrote: Thu Dec 24, 2020 7:03 am That’s not a bad weight for a Pinion equipped full Sussex, it’s a Yes from me.

Deffo has merit, bit worried about the tensioner and rock strikes though.

Foxy had a similar setup on his Zerode and I don’t think he had issues, it looks like it’ll move out the way if it gets clouted.

weeksy wrote: Thu Dec 24, 2020 6:56 am https://www.pinkbike.com/news/first-loo ... bikes.html

Pinion gearbox based newly released bike.

Interesting bike, rubbish article, I also think the chain tensioner is unnecessary.

Those hub gearboxes use epicyclic gear clusters like this...



As above, Sturmey Archer have been doing it for years. My Grandad had a Sturmey Archer gearbox on his bike as a teenager

'Conventional' gears are much simpler (I.e. cheaper) to make, are lighter and more energy efficient. Look at all them tiny bits which have to be fitted together in an epicyclic gearbox! Lots of bearings, seals, clips etc. The gears themselves are also much harder to make precisely than sprockets.

You also limit yourself to only 3 ratios and you can't just pick 3, there are certain limitations on how 'spaced' they are. You can get more than 3 by stacking multiple gear clusters - which is exactly what car auto gearboxes do - but then obviously you need space, weight and money for several sets of gears.

There are 14 speed hub gearboxes https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hub_gear https://www.sjscycles.co.uk/rohloff-internal-hub-gears/

But they aren't cheap, which I suspect is the main reason for the popularity of derailleurs