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Re: Dealership Confidence
Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2023 2:04 pm
by weeksy
Rockburner wrote: Tue Jan 10, 2023 2:00 pm
weeksy wrote: Tue Jan 10, 2023 2:00 pm
The Spin Doctor wrote: Thu Jan 05, 2023 8:15 pm
I fancied a go on the Niken when the dealership up the road had one in... popped in, enquired, got looked at as if I'd crawled out from under a rock (well, it's was a very clean rock) and asked to bring in my National Insurance number.
You're joking, I said... nope, he wasn't. So no test ride.
Why wouldn't you give him your NI number ?
Why is an NI number relevant for a loan bike?
No idea, but it's hardly an official secret type thing they could use is it ?
Re: Dealership Confidence
Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2023 2:06 pm
by Ditchfinder
Rockburner wrote: Tue Jan 10, 2023 2:00 pm
weeksy wrote: Tue Jan 10, 2023 2:00 pm
The Spin Doctor wrote: Thu Jan 05, 2023 8:15 pm
I fancied a go on the Niken when the dealership up the road had one in... popped in, enquired, got looked at as if I'd crawled out from under a rock (well, it's was a very clean rock) and asked to bring in my National Insurance number.
You're joking, I said... nope, he wasn't. So no test ride.
Why wouldn't you give him your NI number ?
Why is an NI number relevant for a loan bike?
So they can do a one-off check that you have a license. I think you can do the check yourself and give them a code if you don't want to hand over your NI no.
Re: Dealership Confidence
Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2023 2:12 pm
by Rockburner
Ditchfinder wrote: Tue Jan 10, 2023 2:06 pm
Rockburner wrote: Tue Jan 10, 2023 2:00 pm
weeksy wrote: Tue Jan 10, 2023 2:00 pm
Why wouldn't you give him your NI number ?
Why is an NI number relevant for a loan bike?
So they can do a one-off check that you have a license. I think you can do the check yourself and give them a code if you don't want to hand over your NI no.
Ah - yes - I'd forgotten that the NI number is tied into the licence as an identifier now.
Re: Dealership Confidence
Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2023 2:13 pm
by Rockburner
weeksy wrote: Tue Jan 10, 2023 2:04 pm
Rockburner wrote: Tue Jan 10, 2023 2:00 pm
weeksy wrote: Tue Jan 10, 2023 2:00 pm
Why wouldn't you give him your NI number ?
Why is an NI number relevant for a loan bike?
No idea, but it's hardly an official secret type thing they could use is it ?
Well - yes - for phishing style attacks on an account it's another piece of the data that identifies you.
Re: Dealership Confidence
Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2023 2:14 pm
by weeksy
Rockburner wrote: Tue Jan 10, 2023 2:13 pm
weeksy wrote: Tue Jan 10, 2023 2:04 pm
Rockburner wrote: Tue Jan 10, 2023 2:00 pm
Why is an NI number relevant for a loan bike?
No idea, but it's hardly an official secret type thing they could use is it ?
Well - yes - for phishing style attacks on an account it's another piece of the data that identifies you.
Yeah i can imagine your local bike place is massively into phishing attacks
Re: Dealership Confidence
Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2023 2:22 pm
by Rockburner
weeksy wrote: Tue Jan 10, 2023 2:14 pm
Rockburner wrote: Tue Jan 10, 2023 2:13 pm
weeksy wrote: Tue Jan 10, 2023 2:04 pm
No idea, but it's hardly an official secret type thing they could use is it ?
Well - yes - for phishing style attacks on an account it's another piece of the data that identifies you.
Yeah i can imagine your local bike place is massively into phishing attacks
I thought you worked in IT and were aware of some of the dangers??
It's not the dealership staff who would be the issue. It's the (potential) hacker crew who got into the dealership system through weak security and are currently using a keyboard scraper software to record every detail of every customer who's information is fed into the system.
Unlikely perhaps, but perfectly possible.
Re: Dealership Confidence
Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2023 2:24 pm
by weeksy
Rockburner wrote: Tue Jan 10, 2023 2:22 pm
weeksy wrote: Tue Jan 10, 2023 2:14 pm
Rockburner wrote: Tue Jan 10, 2023 2:13 pm
Well - yes - for phishing style attacks on an account it's another piece of the data that identifies you.
Yeah i can imagine your local bike place is massively into phishing attacks
I thought you worked in IT and were aware of some of the dangers??
It's not the dealership staff who would be the issue. It's the (potential) hacker crew who got into the dealership system through weak security and are currently using a keyboard scraper software to record every detail of every customer who's information is fed into the system.
Unlikely perhaps, but perfectly possible.
I'm aware of the dangers, but i'm also aware he's only put it into the DVLA site, it's not stored on his PC/machine, at the worst he's written it on a scrap of paper on his desk
Re: Dealership Confidence
Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2023 4:26 pm
by The Spin Doctor
weeksy wrote: Tue Jan 10, 2023 2:00 pm
Why wouldn't you give him your NI number ?
QUOTE from
https://www.gov.uk/national-insurance/y ... nce-number
"To prevent identity fraud, keep your National Insurance number safe. Do not share it with anyone who does not need it."
“What can a fraudster do with my National Insurance number?”.
Used alone, not a lot. However used in combination with other personal information obtained from you on the call, or from a data breach, social media or phishing emails, it could be deployed for an array of illicit activities.
It could be used to steal your identity, illegally claim Government benefits in your name, or take out financial products such as loans, which could have an impact on your finances and credit file.
That's from the Starling Bank fraud prevention page.
So nope, the local dealer, whom I don't know from Adam, is not getting my NI number.
Re: Dealership Confidence
Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2023 4:29 pm
by weeksy
The Spin Doctor wrote: Tue Jan 10, 2023 4:26 pm
weeksy wrote: Tue Jan 10, 2023 2:00 pm
Why wouldn't you give him your NI number ?
QUOTE from
https://www.gov.uk/national-insurance/y ... nce-number
"To prevent identity fraud, keep your National Insurance number safe. Do not share it with anyone who does not need it."
“What can a fraudster do with my National Insurance number?”.
Used alone, not a lot. However used in combination with other personal information obtained from you on the call, or from a data breach, social media or phishing emails, it could be deployed for an array of illicit activities.
It could be used to steal your identity, illegally claim Government benefits in your name, or take out financial products such as loans, which could have an impact on your finances and credit file.
That's from the Starling Bank fraud prevention page.
So nope, the local dealer, whom I don't know from Adam, is not getting my NI number.
Re: Dealership Confidence
Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2023 5:24 pm
by Supermofo
I've been asked for NI number on test rides a few time and always given it to them. On the last couple of occasions I watched the bloke write it down on post it/scrape paper, do the check and then chuck it in the bin. I guess he could then get it out the bin, but they haven't so far as far as I am able to tell.
Re: Dealership Confidence
Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2023 8:08 pm
by Bigyin
Rockburner wrote: Tue Jan 10, 2023 2:00 pm
weeksy wrote: Tue Jan 10, 2023 2:00 pm
The Spin Doctor wrote: Thu Jan 05, 2023 8:15 pm
I fancied a go on the Niken when the dealership up the road had one in... popped in, enquired, got looked at as if I'd crawled out from under a rock (well, it's was a very clean rock) and asked to bring in my National Insurance number.
You're joking, I said... nope, he wasn't. So no test ride.
Why wouldn't you give him your NI number ?
Why is an NI number relevant for a loan bike?
It allows the dealership to check your driving license to make sure you have a full bike license and not currently banned ....DL number, postcode and NI number
No NI number, no test ride
Re: Dealership Confidence
Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2023 9:59 pm
by Bustaspoke
As a supermarket trucker,we have a licence check every 3 months.
We have to bring in our licence,digi card, CPC card & NI number,clerk in the office then checks it all on the DVLA site.They can't do the check without the NI number.
Re: Dealership Confidence
Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2023 10:58 pm
by Dickyboy
Recently registered the death of a mate, registry office told me to shred or burn any paperwork with either NI or NHS number on it due to fraud.
Re: Dealership Confidence
Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2023 11:47 pm
by The Spin Doctor
Has no-one ever looked to see what the current official government directions on licence checks are? Here are the two pages of info...
1) FROM
https://www.gov.uk/check-driving-information
Check
someone's driving licence information
You can use this service to check someone’s driving licence information, for example, vehicles they can drive or any penalty points or disqualifications.
This service is also available in Welsh (Cymraeg).
Check someone’s driving licence online
You need:
the last 8 characters of their driving licence number
a check code from the driver
You must use the code within 21 days. You can only use the code once - you have to get another code to do another check.
Absolutely NO mention that you have to hand over your NI number.
2) FROM
https://www.gov.uk/view-driving-licence
View or share your driving licence information
You can use this service to:
view your driving record, for example vehicles you can drive
check your penalty points or disqualifications
c
reate a licence ‘check code’ to share your driving record with someone, for example a car hire company
The check code will be valid for 21 days.
You’ll need:
your driving licence number
your National Insurance number - find your National Insurance number if you’ve lost it
the postcode on your driving licence
If someone needs your driving licence details, then you generate your OWN check code and hand THAT over... and for that, you DO need your NI number... and for in-job checks an employer will already have it... but there is absolutely ZERO requirement to hand over your NI number to an unknown third party such as a bike dealer.
Re: Dealership Confidence
Posted: Wed Jan 11, 2023 12:04 am
by The Spin Doctor
weeksy wrote: Tue Jan 10, 2023 2:24 pm
I'm aware of the dangers, but i'm also aware he's only put it into the DVLA site, it's not stored on his PC/machine, at the worst he's written it on a scrap of paper on his desk
It took about 2 seconds for Google to find this software:
https://www.refog.com/free-keylogger.html
REFOG can be set up and used by anyone. The monitor does not involve a steep learning curve and does not demand a degree in Computer Science to configure and operate. Simply download your free trial version and get yourself going!
REFOG Personal Monitor keeps a list of all activities you specify it to log. It records all visited Web sites, keeps logs of chats and instant messenger conversations as well as other things typed or received by your kids in chats, messengers, blogs, forums and other online and offline applications.
Stealth Operation
For even better protection, REFOG app can be completely hidden from your kids' eyes. It runs silently and unobtrusively on their PC while taking screen shots and recording every key that they press, logging applications that they use and Web sites that they visit."
Re: Dealership Confidence
Posted: Wed Jan 11, 2023 7:22 am
by weeksy
The Spin Doctor wrote: Tue Jan 10, 2023 11:47 pm
Has no-one ever looked to see what the current official government directions on licence checks are? Here are the two pages of info...
1) FROM
https://www.gov.uk/check-driving-information
Check
someone's driving licence information
You can use this service to check someone’s driving licence information, for example, vehicles they can drive or any penalty points or disqualifications.
This service is also available in Welsh (Cymraeg).
Check someone’s driving licence online
You need:
the last 8 characters of their driving licence number
a check code from the driver
You must use the code within 21 days. You can only use the code once - you have to get another code to do another check.
Absolutely NO mention that you have to hand over your NI number.
2) FROM
https://www.gov.uk/view-driving-licence
View or share your driving licence information
You can use this service to:
view your driving record, for example vehicles you can drive
check your penalty points or disqualifications
c
reate a licence ‘check code’ to share your driving record with someone, for example a car hire company
The check code will be valid for 21 days.
You’ll need:
your driving licence number
your National Insurance number - find your National Insurance number if you’ve lost it
the postcode on your driving licence
If someone needs your driving licence details, then you generate your OWN check code and hand THAT over... and for that, you DO need your NI number... and for in-job checks an employer will already have it... but there is absolutely ZERO requirement to hand over your NI number to an unknown third party such as a bike dealer.
So as you went in without a check code he was perfectly within his rights to ask for the NI number (or a check code).
Re: Dealership Confidence
Posted: Wed Jan 11, 2023 7:24 am
by Horse
The Spin Doctor wrote: Tue Jan 10, 2023 11:47 pm
2) FROM
https://www.gov.uk/view-driving-licence
View or share your driving licence information
You can use this service to:
view your driving record, for example vehicles you can drive
check your penalty points or disqualifications
c
reate a licence ‘check code’ to share your driving record with someone, for example a car hire company
The check code will be valid for 21 days.
Did that recently. Van hire company were happy to see a screenshot of the code to write on their paperwork.
Re: Dealership Confidence
Posted: Wed Jan 11, 2023 8:11 am
by DefTrap
Ime most places (hires etc) expect you to do the licence check yourself and bring the paperwork / checkid.
Re: Dealership Confidence
Posted: Wed Jan 11, 2023 8:14 am
by Count Steer
All I've needed in recent years is to show them my photo licence. Never heard of this check code or been asked for my NI number. Is this a new thing? Last time was summer 2022 for a 'courtesy' car which was essentially a cheap day hire.
Re: Dealership Confidence
Posted: Wed Jan 11, 2023 8:14 am
by weeksy
Count Steer wrote: Wed Jan 11, 2023 8:14 am
All I've needed in recent years is to show them my photo licence. Never heard of this check code or been asked for my NI number. Is this a new thing? Last time was summer 2022.
at least 3-5 years since this came about.