Technology used by only a small number of manufacturers

[Skub]

I still only associate EXUP with Yamaha - do any other manufacturers have something similar?

Yeah,loads of Kawasakis used the flap and still do, as a tool to beat noise regulations. I think that's all it ever did on most bikes anyway.

[Rockburner]

I'm pretty sure no-one else (manufacturer-wise) has used 'Telelever' front suspension. (Yes - invented by A Brit - Hossack IIRC - but BMW are the only manufacturer who used it).

[Rockburner]

I still only associate EXUP with Yamaha - do any other manufacturers have something similar?

Isn't that a 4-stroke version of the 'Power-valve' in 80s/90s 2-strokes though? I can't remember if the RD350LC had one, but the RGV250 certainly did.

[Skub]

I'm pretty sure no-one else (manufacturer-wise) has used 'Telelever' front suspension. (Yes - invented by A Brit - Hossack IIRC - but BMW are the only manufacturer who used it).

Or the ill-fated Yamaha GTS.

[Rockburner]

I'm pretty sure no-one else (manufacturer-wise) has used 'Telelever' front suspension. (Yes - invented by A Brit - Hossack IIRC - but BMW are the only manufacturer who used it).

Or the ill-fated Yamaha GTS.

The Yamaha GTS was a hub-center-steered bike, NOT Hossack/Telelever.

There's quite a few different 'funny-front-ends' fyi.

[Rockburner]

One of the Pre-war German manufacturers did a small, simple 2-stroke which used the rear swing-arm tubing as the exhaust pipe, but I'm damned if I can remember the name.

found it.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Imme_R100 ... r_view.jpg

[KungFooBob]

I'm pretty sure no-one else (manufacturer-wise) has used 'Telelever' front suspension. (Yes - invented by A Brit - Hossack IIRC - but BMW are the only manufacturer who used it).

It's different to a proper hossack setup as it uses sliding tubes.

[DEADPOOL]

Dyson and his amazing vortex powered vacuum cleaner. He spent half of his life trying to get manufacturers interested in the technology, they were only interested in selling brand specific bags.

It caught on eventually, after Dyson defied the odds and bet the farm on doing it himself...

IIRC he made a considerable fortune early on suing those arrogant enough to blatantly copy his design after refusing to even consider it initially.

[Mr. Dazzle]

The irony being that cyclonic separators had been around in industry for decades!

[Rockburner]

I'm pretty sure no-one else (manufacturer-wise) has used 'Telelever' front suspension. (Yes - invented by A Brit - Hossack IIRC - but BMW are the only manufacturer who used it).

It's different to a proper hossack setup as it uses sliding tubes.

I got it wrong:
Hossack =/= BMW DuoLever
SaxTrac =/= BMW Telelever. (IIRC)

DuoLever (Hossack) 'looks' a bit like the old Girder forks, with 2 'swing-arms' but the steering stem is in a different place in the assembly (and other differences).

Telelever is a single swingarm with a ball joint that moves the steering pivot to directly above the wheel and uses the sliding tubes simply to provide steering inputs.

[Skub]

The Yamaha GTS was a hub-center-steered bike, NOT Hossack/Telelever.

There's quite a few different 'funny-front-ends' fyi.

Ah. Didn't know there were differences.

[Mr. Dazzle]

There's quite a few different 'funny-front-ends' fyi.

My very first powered two wheeler, a Peugeot Speedfight 2 just like this (but without rim tape), had a SSSA at the front steered from the 'hinge' of the swingarm.

Maybe the only modern bike with 3 stud wheels too?

[KungFooBob]

I'm pretty sure no-one else (manufacturer-wise) has used 'Telelever' front suspension. (Yes - invented by A Brit - Hossack IIRC - but BMW are the only manufacturer who used it).

It's different to a proper hossack setup as it uses sliding tubes.

I got it wrong:
Hossack =/= BMW DuoLever
SaxTrac =/= BMW Telelever. (IIRC)

DuoLever (Hossack) 'looks' a bit like the old Girder forks, with 2 'swing-arms' but the steering stem is in a different place in the assembly (and other differences).

Telelever is a single swingarm with a ball joint that moves the steering pivot to directly above the wheel and uses the sliding tubes simply to provide steering inputs.

The top yoke is also on a ball joint... I only discoverd this when I removed the forks and it flopped over to one side.

[Rockburner]

There's quite a few different 'funny-front-ends' fyi.

My very first powered two wheeler, a Peugeot Speedfight 2 just like this (but without rim tape), had a SSSA at the front steered from the 'hinge' of the swingarm.

Maybe the only modern bike with 3 stud wheels too?

Isn't that essentially a 'trailing link' setup? any pics of it with it's clothes off?

[Le_Fromage_Grande]

I still only associate EXUP with Yamaha - do any other manufacturers have something similar?

Isn't that a 4-stroke version of the 'Power-valve' in 80s/90s 2-strokes though? I can't remember if the RD350LC had one, but the RGV250 certainly did.

This could get a bit long, Yamaha's original YPVS consists of a cylinder with a cut out in that rotates near the exhaust port and effectively lowers the exhaust port to boost mid range, RGV powervalves do the same thing but work differently, they have a blade that goes up and down, before this Suzuki and Honda used a valve to open and close a chamber in the exhaust to boost mid range power, this what the original Yamaha EXUP valves do, I think the later ones work differently.

Desmo type valve gear was used on the Honda CB450 Black Bomber in the 1960s, it probably copies the Ducati set up of the time.

[Rockburner]

It's different to a proper hossack setup as it uses sliding tubes.

I got it wrong:
Hossack =/= BMW DuoLever
SaxTrac =/= BMW Telelever. (IIRC)

DuoLever (Hossack) 'looks' a bit like the old Girder forks, with 2 'swing-arms' but the steering stem is in a different place in the assembly (and other differences).

Telelever is a single swingarm with a ball joint that moves the steering pivot to directly above the wheel and uses the sliding tubes simply to provide steering inputs.

The top yoke is also on a ball joint... I only discoverd this when I removed the forks and it flopped over to one side.

Which one - Duo or Tele?
Duo (K1200R/K1200S/K1600GT) is 2 ball joints yes,
Tele (R1100XX, R1150XX, R1200GS/RT, R1250GS/RT) is 1 ball joint and a 'normal' yoke in a (irc) plain (possibly ball) bearing like a 'normal' top yoke.

[KungFooBob]

The Tele on my K1200RS, the top yoke is defo on some kind of ball joint.

https://www.realoem.com/bmw/enUS/showpa ... Id=31_0499

[Rockburner]

The Tele on my K1200RS, the top yoke is defo on some kind of ball joint.

That's very interesting and I am perfectly happy to be corrected.

I've never taken out both of the fork tubes at the same time before - so I thought the top-yoke was simply on a bearing. It does make a lot of sense for it to be a ball joint though.

A lot of these images make it look like a stem bearing.

(from here https://motoress.com/rider/bmw-teleleve ... -leverage/)

https://www.bmwmotorcycles.com/en/disco ... lever.html

[KungFooBob]

The Tele on my K1200RS, the top yoke is defo on some kind of ball joint.

That's very interesting and I am perfectly happy to be corrected.

I've never taken out both of the fork tubes at the same time before - so I thought the top-yoke was simply on a bearing. It does make a lot of sense for it to be a ball joint though.

I've added a link to the parts fiche on realoem, if you drill through the part number you can see it's the exact same part number as the lower ball joint.

[Le_Fromage_Grande]

The Saxtrac has a ball joint where the steering head would be, no idea about the BMWs, I've never looked at one close up.
Actually more of a spherical bearing in a cage.