The future of motorcycles as daily transport?

[Le_Fromage_Grande]

I know we are talking commuter bikes on this thread,but since the topic has slid a little sideways to BHP matters....I'm puzzled why any motorcyclist wouldn't want as many horses as he/she could get.

I'll enjoy any bike with an engine regardless of power,but not to get excited about riding a powerful bike,is a bit fucking weird to me.

I guess I'm fully in tune with the industry.

Because I enjoy thrashing the bollocks out of a bike, thrashing the bollocks out of a 150bhp bike needs quite a bit of room.

[The Spin Doctor]

is that a challenge ?

I'll pick the road

Seriously though, there's a limit to how fast you can get round a corner.

You'll probably remember the old 125 GP bikes were often quickest mid-corner.

[Dodgy69]

Would a sort of car style licence work. ? You take one test on either gears or auto. No more tests required,
then when test passed, Under 19 and it's 125cc max, under 25 and 600cc max, then over 25 full power, or summot like.

Would it get more bikes on the road and maybe a few less car's.

[Skub]

I know we are talking commuter bikes on this thread,but since the topic has slid a little sideways to BHP matters....I'm puzzled why any motorcyclist wouldn't want as many horses as he/she could get.

I'll enjoy any bike with an engine regardless of power,but not to get excited about riding a powerful bike,is a bit fucking weird to me.

I guess I'm fully in tune with the industry.

Because I enjoy thrashing the bollocks out of a bike, thrashing the bollocks out of a 150bhp bike needs quite a bit of room.

I get that,but I still wouldn't turn up my nose at a powerful bike.

[Le_Fromage_Grande]

I know we are talking commuter bikes on this thread,but since the topic has slid a little sideways to BHP matters....I'm puzzled why any motorcyclist wouldn't want as many horses as he/she could get.

I'll enjoy any bike with an engine regardless of power,but not to get excited about riding a powerful bike,is a bit fucking weird to me.

I guess I'm fully in tune with the industry.

Because I enjoy thrashing the bollocks out of a bike, thrashing the bollocks out of a 150bhp bike needs quite a bit of room.

I get that,but I still wouldn't turn up my nose at a powerful bike.

Neither would I, I've got a selection pack of motorcycles and I enjoy riding all of them, I'm considering buying another R1, but I seriously think I'd either lose my license or die if I did, as the previous one I rode like a 150bhp LC

[The Spin Doctor]

I get that,but I still wouldn't turn up my nose at a powerful bike.

Fun for ten minutes... then the cost of ownership hits my bank balance.

And potentially the licence. Last time I rode a Hayabusa, I was on the M2 and a BMW M-series something or other decided to see "what it'll do Mister". A tweak of the throttle consigned it to a distant speck in the mirrors. A glance down at the speedo showed me I was the wrong side of 140.

Anyway, there's something life-enhancing about getting the best out of a small bike.

[The Spin Doctor]

Would a sort of car style licence work. ? You take one test on either gears or auto. No more tests required,
then when test passed, Under 19 and it's 125cc max, under 25 and 600cc max, then over 25 full power, or summot like.

Would it get more bikes on the road and maybe a few less car's.

The gears / auto licence exists on bikes too. If you take your test on an auto, you get a licence for one.

What you're proposing is basically a step back to the old 33 hp two year limit that preceded the current stepped licence. If you passed your test on a 125, you could ride a bike up to 33 hp, but after two years you got a full, unrestricted licence. The problem was that (as we found out when we had to start teaching DAS on the bigger bikes) that riders needed to be MUCH better to ride a 500 to the same standard as a 125, thanks to the extra weight, longer length and bigger turning circle and they also had to be more cautious with the more powerful brakes and (whisper it) the extra 30-odd horsepower!

I still remember telling a guy who'd been on L plates on a 125 for five years or so and was now able to do his Direct Access test to be wary about the power. He thought he knew it all and resented having to have an instructor behind him. I did the usual pre-ride briefing about making sure to get the bike turned out of a junction before gassing it. Second day out it rained. Stopping at the end of a road to turn right, I cautioned him again over the radio. He ignored me and gave it a big handful halfway round the turn. He spun up the back wheel. The bike fishtailed wildly for 20 metres or so. How he got it back under control, I have no idea. By the green pallor of his face when I stopped to see if he was alright, neither did he.

Of course, there were hardly any bikes designed to the 33 hp limit which meant riders bought something a installed a restrictor kit... or not. And others took the test on the 125 then basically parked the licence for two years until they could step straight onto a bigger bike, so that wasn't ideal either.

Personally, I think stepped bike licences are here to stay. The likelihood is that at some point stepped licences for drivers will be introduced. Various governments have danced around the idea for quite a while without being brave enough to introduce it, but the introduction of electric cars actually opens a bit of a doorway, I think.

[Dodgy69]

I remember the step up in power from my fizzy to my gp100. Once around a couple of faster bends I was use to it. At 17 I pinched my brothers 750 bonneville one night and went to the pub to show off to my mates. Felt heavy as hell and loads of power, but I got home again.

One bike is very much like another, regarding controls. We quickly learn and adapt to the bigger bike, we have to. I have honestly known half a dozen lads who looked at taking big bike test and when they looked into it all, they went no further.

[matt]

Quite a few of the younger lads I work with say " I really want a big bike, I'm going to do my test next year" but they never do, and I don't think they ever will. Mainly because of the cost and hassle of it all.

Personally I've always had bikes, I couldn't wait to get my licence and used to ride all year. Nowadays though the bike seems to get parked up Octoberish and doesn't see daylight until march/April. I hate being cold and can't see the fun in riding on roads in winter, jumping in the car to go to work is a much easier option as my commute is rural and I don't have to deal with any traffic.
It would be different if I lived somewhere like the canaries though, I probably wouldn't even own a car then.

[Horse]

It does seem crazy to make and market bikes capable of three times the national speed limit in seconds and expect legislation to sit back and do nothing about it.

It was in the LC and RGV era that MCN's 100mph 250!" claims were quoted in Parliament, leading to the 125cc 12hp learner limit*.

* For young whippersnappers, previously it was 250cc

[Dodgy69]

I remember the step up in power from my fizzy to my gp100. Once around a couple of faster bends I was use to it. At 17 I pinched my brothers 750 bonneville one night and went to the pub to show off to my mates. Felt heavy as hell and loads of power, but I got home again.

Same for me but that's going from a something with 10bhp to 50bhp and even then it was a big heavy thing.
But imagine going from a GP100 to a new 220bhp (<200kg) superbike!

It does seem crazy to make and market bikes capable of three times the national speed limit in seconds and expect legislation to sit back and do nothing about it.

I've always said I'd be happy to see all vehicles restricted by design to 100mph.
Then we'd get really exotic smaller stuff like in Japan back in the 80's and 90's. I was never a fan of these big bhp bikes that seemed to take over from the mid-90's, I had them myself but it was folly, I'm genuinely lucky I didn't kill myself or someone else with one.

AFAIK, I can pass my car test in a micra and buy a focus RS the day after, if funds available. I do think we should build up experience somehow, but repeating basic road knowledge or highway code stuff to get a pass is a put off for many.

The difference from a gp100 to a 100hp bike is massive, but as we all know, the power is in the wrist, then there's trackdays where the extra power can be used safely.

Also, why do people need to retake their CBT every few years if their regular riders.

[Nordboy]

I spoke with one of the owners of my local honda/ suzuki/ indian main dealer this week.

Asked him how business was seeing as the front doors were closed most of 2020. He said that during 2020 they sold only 1 less bike than during 2019. And across the full range of bikes as well.

So people are still buying. So the future of bikes can’t be that bleak?

[Dodgy69]

I spoke with one of the owners of my local honda/ suzuki/ indian main dealer this week.

Asked him how business was seeing as the front doors were closed most of 2020. He said that during 2020 they sold only 1 less bike than during 2019. And across the full range of bikes as well.

So people are still buying. So the future of bikes can’t be that bleak?

Thats good to hear, and if they kept our roads pothole free, more safe bike parking facilities, hang those who steal from others and made it a bit warmer with more sun, sale's could increase further.

[Yorick]

Quite a few of the younger lads I work with say " I really want a big bike, I'm going to do my test next year" but they never do, and I don't think they ever will. Mainly because of the cost and hassle of it all.

Personally I've always had bikes, I couldn't wait to get my licence and used to ride all year. Nowadays though the bike seems to get parked up Octoberish and doesn't see daylight until march/April. I hate being cold and can't see the fun in riding on roads in winter, jumping in the car to go to work is a much easier option as my commute is rural and I don't have to deal with any traffic.
It would be different if I lived somewhere like the canaries though, I probably wouldn't even own a car then.

*waves*


But we need the car for shopping and airport pickups.

And plenty of 4WD fun to be had.

[Dickyboy]

Had an email from on yer bike Aylesbury telling me that supply in 2021 is gonna be a problem, so to order now if you are hankering after a new bike
Bitd, (early 80's) getting on a bike seemed way cheaper than getting a car, now the reverse seems true. Dad was into his bikes, all three sons got into bikes, none of my sons or nephews (25-35yo) have shown any interest in having a bike

[Mr. Dazzle]

When I learned in 2001 it was about even....the tests were pretty much identical. Cars were more expensive to buy and insure though. I didnt do DAS though cause I wasn't allowed, you have/had to be 21 and I was 17.

I don't even know what you have to do to get a licence these days. People always ask me cause I've got a bike, but I'm the last person who'd know. I've already got a licence!

[Taipan]

I know we are talking commuter bikes on this thread,but since the topic has slid a little sideways to BHP matters....I'm puzzled why any motorcyclist wouldn't want as many horses as he/she could get.

I'll enjoy any bike with an engine regardless of power,but not to get excited about riding a powerful bike,is a bit fucking weird to me.

I guess I'm fully in tune with the industry.

Cos I'm a shite rider and bigger bikes are too powerful for me and I don't have enough sense to not try and use that power. TBH anything over 70bhp is wasted on me!

[Skub]

Cos I'm a shite rider and bigger bikes are too powerful for me and I don't have enough sense to not try and use that power. TBH anything over 70bhp is wasted on me!

Probably the only difference between you and me Tenpin,is I'm not smart enough to be scared.

[Yorick]

Cos I'm a shite rider and bigger bikes are too powerful for me and I don't have enough sense to not try and use that power. TBH anything over 70bhp is wasted on me!

Probably the only difference between you and me Tenpin,is I'm not smart enough to be scared.

*waves*

[The Spin Doctor]

I remember the step up in power from my fizzy to my gp100. Once around a couple of faster bends I was use to it. At 17 I pinched my brothers 750 bonneville one night and went to the pub to show off to my mates. Felt heavy as hell and loads of power, but I got home again.

One bike is very much like another, regarding controls. We quickly learn and adapt to the bigger bike, we have to.

Unfortunately, accident statistics say otherwise... one of the big factors in KSI crashes is "bike unfamiliar to the rider".

And increasingly bikes are getting away from the 'front brake on the right, clutch on the left, rear brake under your right foot, gears under the left'. There are DCT gearboxes, combined brakes, traction control, riding modes and ABS to understand. My experience on running training courses is that even those riders keen to improve their skills are often hazy on just how the bike under them is working.

I have honestly known half a dozen lads who looked at taking big bike test and when they looked into it all, they went no further.

As I've said, I think the current multi-test format is wrong but it's a political response to the lack of interest shown by the motorcycle industry here in the UK. The MCIA still has little or no interest in creating better riders, just in bringing more and more bike training schools under their control.