Test ride : Honda CB1000R. 2021 model.

[Mr. Dazzle]

Quite right - maximum motor RPM is one of the big limits. That's why a Tesla with 700bhp still tops out at 130mph. Most EVs have a single speed gearbox and hence hit the redline long before they run out of power. Some of them now have twin speeds though so they can go really fast (I think Tesla have topped 200mph now).

A big big part of my job now is figuring out how to make the motors spin faster so that you can have high speed and still only have a single speed box thus saving weight. Faster electric motors also tend to be more efficient.

EV motors are getting pretty exotic now, full of carbon fibre and fancy processes. They're not as glamorous as a Ferrari V12 or a MotoGP V4, but it's where all the big money and tech is going for obvious reasons.

[The Spin Doctor]

Quite right - maximum motor RPM is one of the big limits. That's why a Tesla with 700bhp still tops out at 130mph. Most EVs have a single speed gearbox and hence hit the redline long before they run out of power. Some of them now have twin speeds though so they can go really fast (I think Tesla have topped 200mph now).

A big big part of my job now is figuring out how to make the motors spin faster so that you can have high speed and still only have a single speed box thus saving weight. Faster electric motors also tend to be more efficient.

EV motors are getting pretty exotic now, full of carbon fibre and fancy processes. They're not as glamorous as a Ferrari V12 or a MotoGP V4, but it's where all the big money and tech is going for obvious reasons.

Sounds fascinating, actually. I'm excited by EVs. But I guess I'm weird... or is that wired?

[Le_Fromage_Grande]

I think the disliking inline 4s is more of a disliking modern Japanese motorcycle inline 4s because they're tuned for maximum power and have little fly wheel effect, my 1170 Kawasaki has tons of torque and it's all low down as the redline is 9500rpm, with flat slide carbs you get instant torque at the back wheel from pretty near tick over, it also helps that the bike is quite light, I'm not sure what it weighs, but it's got no road going gear, a lightweight exhaust and the air cooled engine weighs less than a modern water cooled engine (using the age old "fuck me that's heavy" test)

[The Spin Doctor]

I think the disliking inline 4s is more of a disliking modern Japanese motorcycle inline 4s because they're tuned for maximum power and have little fly wheel effect, my 1170 Kawasaki has tons of torque and it's all low down as the redline is 9500rpm, with flat slide carbs you get instant torque at the back wheel from pretty near tick over, it also helps that the bike is quite light, I'm not sure what it weighs, but it's got no road going gear, a lightweight exhaust and the air cooled engine weighs less than a modern water cooled engine (using the age old "fuck me that's heavy" test)

Wouldn't a heavier flywheel actually slow down acceleration?

[Mr. Dazzle]

Wouldn't a heavier flywheel actually slow down acceleration?

It would, which is why you fit lightened ones in race vehicles. Downside is less refinement.

Older, slower revving bikes tend to be more grunty 'cause they're long stroke engines. Longer strokes mean the crank has a longer lever arm, so the same force from the piston is more torque on the crank. The downside of that is that it's harder to rev high and get big power. My old Triumph has a really long stroke motor, so it's got lots of bottom end but also tops out at <7000rpm.

[Le_Fromage_Grande]

I think the disliking inline 4s is more of a disliking modern Japanese motorcycle inline 4s because they're tuned for maximum power and have little fly wheel effect, my 1170 Kawasaki has tons of torque and it's all low down as the redline is 9500rpm, with flat slide carbs you get instant torque at the back wheel from pretty near tick over, it also helps that the bike is quite light, I'm not sure what it weighs, but it's got no road going gear, a lightweight exhaust and the air cooled engine weighs less than a modern water cooled engine (using the age old "fuck me that's heavy" test)

Wouldn't a heavier flywheel actually slow down acceleration?

In theory yes, but on dirt bikes a lot of people like the way a heavier flywheel feels (you can buy fly wheel weights for popular MX bikes), I don't understand the physics of it but it makes an engine feel like it has more mid range power when the reality is that it has less because the engine has more weight to spin round, the same seems to work on tarmac bikes, well it does for me - and this is purely my opinion, there is no science to back this up.

[Mr. Dazzle]

It's probably 'cause a heavy flywheel also works to prevent revs dropping quickly for exactly the same reason it stops them rising quickly. So if you start to get bogged down you sort of 'steamroller' through and keep the revs up. Particularly useful on a big single which has large gaps between power pulses.

[Le_Fromage_Grande]

Wouldn't a heavier flywheel actually slow down acceleration?

It would, which is why you fit lightened ones in race vehicles. Downside is less refinement.

Older, slower revving bikes tend to be more grunty 'cause they're long stroke engines. Longer strokes mean the crank has a longer lever arm, so the same force from the piston is more torque on the crank. The downside of that is that it's harder to rev high and get big power. My old Triumph has a really long stroke motor, so it's got lots of bottom end but also tops out at <7000rpm.

Or it could be this, my Z is an old fashioned long stroke engine, though it is quite over square, 75mm x 66mm, the CB1000R is 75 x 56.5, which is interesting as it's nearly 10mm less stroke, it's going to feel revvy.

[Le_Fromage_Grande]

It's probably 'cause a heavy flywheel also works to prevent revs dropping quickly for exactly the same reason it stops them rising quickly. So if you start to get bogged down you sort of 'steamroller' through and keep the revs up. Particularly useful on a big single which has large gaps between power pulses.

That's what I've always thought, but as I said there's no science to back it up.

[Mr. Dazzle]

Or it could be this, my Z is an old fashioned long stroke engine, though it is quite over square, 75mm x 66mm,

The Triumph is 71mm bore and 82mm stroke revs? What are revs?

[Le_Fromage_Grande]

Or it could be this, my Z is an old fashioned long stroke engine, though it is quite over square, 75mm x 66mm,

The Triumph is 71mm bore and 82mm stroke revs? What are revs?

That's going to feel lethargic, but you'll never need to change gear.

[Tricky]

[Dodgy69]

That Pan don't arf fly.

[Taipan]

That Supercharged CBR!

[Mr. Dazzle]

Yeah I was surprised to see that the Ducati still pulled away!

[KungFooBob]

There's only a 25bhp power difference and the Panigale has launch control, anti-wheelie, traction, etc...

They might have mentioned that in the video, but I've not watched it with sound.

[Mr. Dazzle]

Indeed. You'll not be surprised to know that we've got rooms full of Dynos and spinny rigs to look into this stuff. All of which is also potentially needed at high/low temperature and humidity while also subject to vibration etc.

Consumer automotive is probably the hardest industry to do this stuff in. It's fairly unique in that there's a very high level of technical sophistication coupled with very badly controlled maintenance (compared to anything else of equal complexity) and a very hard to define usage pattern. Anything else which comes close on performance terms (e.g. motorsport, aircraft, medical kit) has much much tighter controls on how it's used and maintained.

In terms of failing quickly - we blow our motors up Just keep going faster and faster until they burst. It makes the whole building shake when they go!

[lostboy]

There's only a 25bhp power difference and the Panigale has launch control, anti-wheelie, traction, etc...

They might have mentioned that in the video, but I've not watched it with sound.

Aerodynamics.

[lostboy]

There's only a 25bhp power difference and the Panigale has launch control, anti-wheelie, traction, etc...

They might have mentioned that in the video, but I've not watched it with sound.

Aerodynamics.