Astrazeneca/Oxford vaccine approved

[Mr. Dazzle]

I don't know about any of that, I just said he has an OBE and he's very good at getting funding,

Maybe he's good at getting funding 'cause he's good at what he does ('what he does' being things other than 'getting funding').

[DefTrap]

I'm a little confused, Neil Ferguson has said MHRA are looking into it urgently. Nice that he's speaking on their behalf, is he part of MHRA or have MHRA publicly said that?

He's just parroting and stating the bleeding obvious, is the way I see it. He's not even colouring it. If every single epidemioligist is asked 24/7 for their opinion then the reporting of the banal will happen.

[Mr. Dazzle]

I'm a little confused, Neil Ferguson has said MHRA are looking into it urgently. Nice that he's speaking on their behalf, is he part of MHRA or have MHRA publicly said that?

He's just parroting and stating the bleeding obvious, is the way I see it. He's not even colouring it. If every single epidemioligist is asked 24/7 for their opinion then the reporting of the banal will happen.

Well yeah.

You've got the situation where multiple countries are restricting the use of AZ cause of clots. Even if you're the most mean spirited cynic you should concede that at least some people in those countries genuinely know what they're doing and they do it without agenda.

The MHRA would be remiss if they DIDN'T consider clotting as a potential issue. It's the reason they exist....you know, to consider stuff.

[DefTrap]

The MHRA would be remiss if they DIDN'T consider clotting as a potential issue. It's the reason they exist....you know, to consider stuff.

There's a system in place for this, as you would expect. https://www.gov.uk/government/publicati ... -reporting

[Saga Lout]

I've worked on some projects with Ferguson for about 8 years. I don't think he's a charlatan; he is driven, can be difficult and not always pleasant but he is one of the most respected epidemiologists in the world with a strong track record and enviable H index. As far as I can tell he is motivated by the desire to make the world a safer place

I don't know about any of that, I just said he has an OBE and he's very good at getting funding, I have no basis to call him a charlatan (and I didn't).
The criticism comes from people way more qualified than me.

Saga?

Well, nice as it is to be so respected ( ) I'm basing my opinion on his "millions will die if everybody doesn't hide away... erm... except me, don't make me hide away 'cos I need to get my leg over".

[Mussels]

I'm a little confused, Neil Ferguson has said MHRA are looking into it urgently. Nice that he's speaking on their behalf, is he part of MHRA or have MHRA publicly said that?

He's just parroting and stating the bleeding obvious, is the way I see it. He's not even colouring it. If every single epidemioligist is asked 24/7 for their opinion then the reporting of the banal will happen.

What is not obvious is adding the word 'urgent' to it, that changes it from routine analysis to something more panicked. Have MHRA said anything about it being urgent or is he just trying to put a spin on it?

[DefTrap]

What is not obvious is adding the word 'urgent' to it, that changes it from routine analysis to something more panicked. Have MHRA said anything about it being urgent or is he just trying to put a spin on it?

A blood clot is considered a "Serious Adverse Event", yes it's urgent. I wouldn't say "panicked" because I work in the industry, there's a process to work through, but you don't necessarily get an answer overnight and new data is coming in all the time. Patient Safety is paramount. Vaccines don't really get withdrawn very often though, not completely withdrawn anyway. A bit of caution is prudent sometimes.

[Hoonercat]

I see the UK has joined the likes of Germany and France in 'rubbishing' the AZ vaccine

Van-Tam:

in younger age groups, the risk/benefit balance is finely balanced.

[irie]

... A bit of caution is prudent sometimes.

Caution is always prudent when dealing with the unknown.

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/mhra ... lood-clots

The benefits of vaccination continue to outweigh any risks but the MHRA advises careful consideration be given to people who are at higher risk of specific types of blood clots because of their medical condition.
...
By 31 March 20.2 million doses of the COVID-19 Vaccine AstraZeneca had been given in the UK meaning the overall risk of these blood clots is approximately 4 people in a million who receive the vaccine.
...
As a precaution, administration of COVID-19 Vaccine AstraZeneca in people of any age who are at higher risk of blood clots because of their medical condition should be considered only if benefits from the protection from COVID-19 infection outweighs potential risks.

If alternative vaccines are available without these risks then it is logical to use them for 'at risk' groups. There may be other risks with these alternative vaccines which may become apparent after use, of course ...

My highlight

[Bike Breaker]

I see the UK has joined the likes of Germany and France in 'rubbishing' the AZ vaccine

Hardly 'rubbishing'.

Van-Tam:

in younger age groups, the risk/benefit balance is finely balanced.

[Mr. Dazzle]

This is more about young people not being that susceptible to Covid isn't it?

In older people Covid presents a major risk, so some tiny extra risk of blood clots is justified. People under 30 are very very very unlikely to die from Covid, so the tiny risk of a blood clot isn't worth taking - particularly if there are other vaccines available.

[Hoonercat]

I see the UK has joined the likes of Germany and France in 'rubbishing' the AZ vaccine

Hardly 'rubbishing'.

Van-Tam:

in younger age groups, the risk/benefit balance is finely balanced.

Do I have to wait until the UK moves from under 30s to under 55s before I can call it 'rubbishing'? Given the tone of language used throughout this thread whenever the likes of France or Germany raise caution about side effects of the AZ vaccine, I assumed it would be ok. Soz.

[Saga Lout]

Do I have to wait until the UK moves from under 30s to under 55s before I can call it 'rubbishing'? Given the tone of language used throughout this thread whenever the likes of France or Germany raise caution about side effects of the AZ vaccine, I assumed it would be ok. Soz.

Some unprincipled people have noted the short time between the EU complaining that they're not getting enough of the AstraZeneca vaccine and threatening to interfere with the distribution and then telling everybody who will listen that the vaccine is unsafe to claim that the EU is acting out of malice. The two events are unrelated as anybody with both eyes closed can see.

[gremlin]

I do wonder how many people will shun the AZ vaccine on the basis of a negligible risk of a blood clot whilst complaining they still can't get on a long haul flight to the Maldives because of this pandemic.....

[Nobby]

I do wonder how many people will shun the AZ vaccine on the basis of a negligible risk of a blood clot, yet are willing to risk DVT on a long haul flight to the Maldives

[weeksy]

I do wonder how many people will shun the AZ vaccine on the basis of a negligible risk of a blood clot whilst complaining they still can't get on a long haul flight to the Maldives because of this pandemic.....

17?

[Horse]

I do wonder how many people will shun the AZ vaccine on the basis of a negligible risk of a blood clot whilst complaining they still can't get on a long haul flight to the Maldives because of this pandemic.....

17?

Before we all have a go, is there a prize?

[weeksy]

I do wonder how many people will shun the AZ vaccine on the basis of a negligible risk of a blood clot whilst complaining they still can't get on a long haul flight to the Maldives because of this pandemic.....

17?

Before we all have a go, is there a prize?

It's his game, he puts up the prizes.

[Supermofo]

Must admit with all the current info I'd rather have the Tizer than the AZ one, but I've already had the AZ first dose so bit late to worry now.

Plus I imagine my life chances are dramatically worse ever time I strap my lid on for a ride so the %'s in the game of life aren't terrible.

I just hope this is the only side effect. I should imagine there are others in all the vaccines that may come to light over the next months/years/decades but at the moment Covid is still more likely to get you now. So it's the usual life gamble I guess.

[Horse]

I just hope this is the only side effect. I should imagine there are others in all the vaccines that may come to light over the next months/years/decades but at the moment Covid is still more likely to get you now.

The full implications/ long-term effects of covid are still coming to light.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/mobile.reu ... SKBN2BT2ZI

One in three COVID-19 survivors in a study of more than 230,000 mostly American patients were diagnosed with a brain or psychiatric disorder within six months, suggesting the pandemic could lead to a wave of mental and neurological problems, scientists said on Tuesday.

Researchers who conducted the analysis said it was not clear how the virus was linked to psychiatric conditions such as anxiety and depression, but that these were the most common diagnoses among the 14 disorders they looked at.

Post-COVID cases of stroke, dementia and other neurological disorders were rarer, the researchers said, but were still significant, especially in those who had severe COVID-19.