What 4x4 For 4K

[Horse]

Found it:

" the idea was, on approach to a bend, to lift slightly on the throttle then blip to trigger a downshift, then apply enough throttle to keep it in that gear into and through the bend. "

[slowsider]

Found it:

" the idea was, on approach to a bend, to lift slightly on the throttle then blip to trigger a downshift, then apply enough throttle to keep it in that gear into and through the bend. "

Best done in sport mode rather than eco, to hold the gear higher in the revs. IME

[Cousin Jack]

Last 6 cars in our family have been autos. Wife won't drive a manual (she has probably forgotten how to) and although I can I much prefer an auto except for a quick half-hour fun blast. Try a daily commute from MK to London in a manual and you will soon become an auto convert.

Both current cars have flappy paddles, as far as I am concerned you could leave them off, I never use them. Why buy a dg and bark yourself, if I am in a hurry I just chose sport mode on the box.

[Couchy]

I don't, my 50 pencing of corners is legendary! I was referring to people who do, be those bends on a track or some amazing B-roads somewhere? A dsg type box is better everywhere. Go into any supercar showroom and manual boxes will be very rare to find as it's old hat technology. I don't think MCLaren have even offered a manual as an option?

IIRC dual clutch autos had huge problems when they came out especially with more powerful engines, putting dry clutches in them was a bad mistake as people drove them like a slushbox and burnt the clutches, bigger engines just burnt the clutches whatever.
Wet clutches work much better but mean they get 0.001mpg less and sales guys don't like that so many stuck with dry clutches.

They may have improved recently but I don't trust them yet, manufacturers seem happy to roll out poorly designed tech if it looks good in marketing stuff.

Apart from that all autos are undesirable in corners, changing gear mid corner is going to throw the car off balance and if you are driving quickly you really don't want that to happen. Manual override helps that but there are still cars around with manual override that still gets overridden by the computer.

Plenty of performance cars with dual clutch semi autos also have IMU’s and don’t change mid corner, they also measure steering angle for the same reason. It just isn’t an issue as it used to be, they also change gear so quick it doesn’t affect the chassis mid corner. I’m torn as to what I prefer in a performance car as I love the semi autos but I also enjoy a manual box. But I always pick an auto as driving fast for enjoyment is rare these days.

[Wossname]

Found it:

" the idea was, on approach to a bend, to lift slightly on the throttle then blip to trigger a downshift, then apply enough throttle to keep it in that gear into and through the bend. "

You're very quickly doing 40mph more than you intended tho... (swidt). How do you blip an auto?

[lostboy]

That's why the DSG is the winner. My R is an auto "slush box" for crawling around and a flappy paddle manual when I want to rip a few B roads.

My daughter has a Scirroco R and have only used the flappy paddle on that very gently as she has only had it a while and didnt want to abuse her new car. It seemed quite good and responsive to quick changes. My mate has an Evo 10 with a flappy paddle box and a heavily breathed on motor but is scared of its performance and for quite a while he kept asking me to drive it to see what it could do as he was too nervous to push it as he isnt really a driver but always wanted that car for its looks etc.

I found the downchanges while braking hard for a corner were pretty sluggish to the extent i backed off as it really didnt feel right. I suggested he have it looked at and a specialist found a variety of problems with the gearbox that his gentle driving didnt flag up. He now has it sorted but i havent driven it again yet due to lockdowns etc despite him asking me to give it a blast

For me, i like the old manual for the control rather than an auto but i need more time with flappy paddle cars to get used to them and use them properly

Scirocco R uses tech at least one model older than equivalent Golf, usually two versions older.

Can't comment about your mate's Evo 10 but my Golf has absolutely no issues with downchanges - very quick and blipper works beautifully as well. Mine may not be standard.........

I'm still amused by this thread. So much love for gearbox technology when just about every performance car is using auto or modified auto (flappy paddle) as are all the racers.

Interesting how many people are espousing the problems of unsettling a car with an auto gearbox and no-one has mentioned that you have to take a hand off the wheel to change gear in a manual. And no-one brakes left footed in their auto?!

[lostboy]

Found it:

" the idea was, on approach to a bend, to lift slightly on the throttle then blip to trigger a downshift, then apply enough throttle to keep it in that gear into and through the bend. "

You're very quickly doing 40mph more than you intended tho... (swidt). How do you blip an auto?

The car does it for me.

[Le_Fromage_Grande]

My mate has an Evo 10 with a flappy paddle box and a heavily breathed on motor but is scared of its performance and for quite a while he kept asking me to drive it to see what it could do as he was too nervous to push it as he isnt really a driver but always wanted that car for its looks etc.

I'll happily swap it for my 143bhp Lancer that looks like an EVO 10 if you don't look too closely

[Slenver]

I'm still amused by this thread. So much love for gearbox technology when just about every performance car is using auto or modified auto (flappy paddle) as are all the racers.

The thing is that modern autos are objectively better in almost every way - they're faster, more efficient and wear less, as well as being easier, more practical for most situations etc. So manufacturers will make them and offer them. The reason they've become so prevalent now is that customers prefer them (because, presumably of the advantages above) so in many cases there's not even a manual option because they sell so few.

But that doesn't mean people aren't allowed to enjoy manuals. And several manufacturers make manual options specifically to appeal to old-skool petrolheads that want to do it themselves and enjoy that particular control over the car. Both the manufacturer and the buyer know that it's less efficient, slower, blah blah, it's not a secret, but that's not all driving is about for everyone. I'm sure as bikers most people here can understand that even if it doesn't float their particular boat.

Manuals will continue to die out and for good reasons. And so will the internal combustion engine. Doesn't mean some people won't still want to enjoy a more analog experience for the sake of it.

[Mr. Dazzle]

Can't say I've ever had an auto gearbox change unexpectedly and throw the car 'off balance'.

If you're just mooching along then a change at the 'wrong' moment isn't gonna upset the car. If you're trying to drive quickly then you will paying attention and it's pretty easy to tell when it's gonna shift IME. Besides, you probably shouldn't be exploring the fine 10/10ths limits of balance and grip on the road in a modern fat tyres car anyway

From what I recall, the 8 speed ZF unit in Jags and Beemers won't override the driver in flappy mode either, it will just bounce off the rev limiter/bog down.

Interesting side note for some...AFAIK the dual clutch gearbox came into the mainstream from F1 in the late 90s, but they never actually bothered with the second clutch after testing! They originally had 2 like in a DSG box, but they realised that with sufficiently good control and some clever predictive modelling controllers they could actually be in two gears simultaneously, very very briefly. So they have the same 'double selector' layout but only the one clutch. That's the "seamless shift" tech than also made its way over the MotoGP....not sure if they still have it.

[Horse]

Found it:

" the idea was, on approach to a bend, to lift slightly on the throttle then blip to trigger a downshift, then apply enough throttle to keep it in that gear into and through the bend. "

You're very quickly doing 40mph more than you intended tho... (swidt). How do you blip an auto?

Re 40 mph faster, this was what, apparently, Met police instructors were covering. I guess they had a fair idea.

Blip? Dunno.

[Yorick]

Found it:

" the idea was, on approach to a bend, to lift slightly on the throttle then blip to trigger a downshift, then apply enough throttle to keep it in that gear into and through the bend. "

You're very quickly doing 40mph more than you intended tho... (swidt). How do you blip an auto?

In my TT, if it was in sports mode and braking hard, it blipped and slammed down the gearbox and you felt the engine braking.

[Mr. Dazzle]

I think McLarens might allow you to preselect gears, like they used to do in F1 before it was banned.

So you plant your foot on a straight and it changes up automatically. In the meantime you click 'down' on the paddles to whatever gear you want to be in for the next bend, but because you've still got your foot down it won't change down. When you slam on the brakes it does the downshifts to your preset gear and obviously nails them at just the right points for maximum engine braking/stability.

[Cousin Jack]

And no-one brakes left footed in their auto?!

I have been known to.

Especially when teaching someone a lesson in the TL GP. Left food hard on the brake, right foot on the throttle, torque converter stalls, then off the brake and launch.....................................

Only ever done it with old-style slush boxes, and it's bad for the box and the back axle, and expensive in tyres but the old Granada could embarrass some seriously quick cars that way.

[slowsider]

And no-one brakes left footed in their auto?!

I have been known to.

Especially when teaching someone a lesson in the TL GP. Left food hard on the brake, right foot on the throttle, torque converter stalls, then off the brake and launch.....................................

Only ever done it with old-style slush boxes, and it's bad for the box and the back axle, and expensive in tyres but the old Granada could embarrass some seriously quick cars that way.

Think I saw you in an old episode of The Sweeney

[Mr. Dazzle]

I always drive auto cars like a kart....foot on each pedal. Just because really.

[Mussels]

Interesting reading, it seems gearbox logic has come along a lot in the background. All I need to do now is use left foot braking to pull away from junctions better.

[slowsider]

I always drive auto cars like a kart....foot on each pedal. Just because really.

You sure you mean kart ?

[gremlin]

I was thinking of this thread as I drove the wife's CRV into work this morning. I was paying particular attention to the gear changes and apart from one or two occasions I didn't feel any gear changes whatsoever. Smooth as silk. No lag from pull away. Not one iota of bad manners. Way better than the Merc 'box IMO. I was tempted, at one point, to play with the flappy-paddles to shift up and down, but given that the climate control had the temperature just so, the auto seat had adjusted to my comfort setting based on it recognising my key fob and Magic FM was pushing out some wheel-tapping favourite sounds from the ICE system that automatically selects my 6 favourite stations, I decided to just sit and relax instead....

[Le_Fromage_Grande]

I was thinking of this thread as I drove the wife's CRV into work this morning. I was paying particular attention to the gear changes and apart from one or two occasions I didn't feel any gear changes whatsoever. Smooth as silk. No lag from pull away. Not one iota of bad manners. Way better than the Merc 'box IMO. I was tempted, at one point, to play with the flappy-paddles to shift up and down, but given that the climate control had the temperature just so, the auto seat had adjusted to my comfort setting based on it recognising my key fob and Magic FM was pushing out some wheel-tapping favourite sounds from the ICE system that automatically selects my 6 favourite stations, I decided to just sit and relax instead....

Hmm, I took the dual carriage way to work this morning rather than the special stage, both take about the same amount of time, 15 minutes.