Astrazeneca/Oxford vaccine approved

[slowsider]

So in a nutshell, the UK insisted that Astrazeneca UK-produced vac's will only go to the UK, up to the point where the order is met = that's fine.
EU threaten to do the same = uproar.

"Do the same"
NO

The UK made an AGREEMENT with the maker of the vaccine for exclusivity for one of its production lines.
The EU are looking to FORCE the vaccine maker to not export any of their product from the EU.

Your insight to a confidential contract is exceptional.
The eu seem to want to ensure any eu production is delivered to the eu contract. The UK seems to want to do the reciprocal.

[irie]

Remarks by Commissioner Stella Kyriakides on vaccines today.

https://ec.europa.eu/commission/pressco ... ECH_21_267

Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen.

I last communicated with you on Monday to express our serious concerns regarding the intention of AstraZeneca to supply considerably fewer doses in the coming weeks than agreed and announced.

Since then, we have been making all efforts to resolve the situation.

We convened a third meeting of the Steering Board on Monday night, which resulted again in insufficient explanations from the company, and deep dissatisfaction among the Member States.

Let me be crystal clear: the 27 European Union Member States are united that AstraZeneca needs to deliver on its commitments in our agreement.

We are in a pandemic. We lose people every day.

These are not numbers. They are not statistics. These are persons, with families, with friends and colleagues that are all affected as well.

Pharmaceutical companies, vaccine developers, have moral, societal and contractual responsibilities, which they need to uphold.

The view that the company is not obliged to deliver because we signed a ‘best effort' agreement is neither correct nor is it acceptable.

We signed an Advance Purchase Agreement for a product which at the time did not exist, and which still today is not yet authorised. And we signed it precisely to ensure that the company builds the manufacturing capacity to produce the vaccine early, so that they can deliver a certain volume of doses the day that it is authorised.

The logic of these agreements was as valid then as it is now: we provide a de-risking investment up front, in order to get a binding commitment from the company to pre-produce, even before it gets authorisation.

Not being able to ensure manufacturing capacity is against the letter and the spirit of our agreement.

We reject the logic of first come, first served. That may work at the neighbourhood butchers, but not in contracts. And not in our Advance Purchase Agreements.

There's no priority clause in the Advance Purchase Agreement.

And there's also no hierarchy of the four production plants named in the Advance Purchase Agreement. Two are located in the EU and two are located in UK.

We intend to defend the integrity of our investments and the taxpayers' money that has been invested.

We remain always open to engage with the company to resolve any outstanding issues in the spirit of true collaboration and responsibility.

That was always the spirit of our engagement with vaccine manufacturers since last spring.

This evening, at 18:30, the Steering Board will convene again.

I call on AstraZeneca to engage fully, to rebuild trust, to provide complete information and to live up to its contractual, societal and moral obligations.

Thank you very much.

Do you really think that the UK will give vaccine, which it is legally entitled to, to the EU to reduce its mortality rates which by definition means increasing UK mortality rates?

Good luck with that, you screwed up and you're pissing into the wind.

Fail.

[DEADPOOL]

If someone at the EU really allowed that "best effort" phrase to be written into the agreement, the EU don't have a leg to stand on.

At the time, no one could really have been certain of the manufacturing capacity for a new drug so they would have been hedging their bets. Much easier with the UK, "we'll take 100million shots thanks".

[Hoonercat]

Remarks by Commissioner Stella Kyriakides on vaccines today.

https://ec.europa.eu/commission/pressco ... ECH_21_267

Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen.

I last communicated with you on Monday to express our serious concerns regarding the intention of AstraZeneca to supply considerably fewer doses in the coming weeks than agreed and announced.

Since then, we have been making all efforts to resolve the situation.

We convened a third meeting of the Steering Board on Monday night, which resulted again in insufficient explanations from the company, and deep dissatisfaction among the Member States.

Let me be crystal clear: the 27 European Union Member States are united that AstraZeneca needs to deliver on its commitments in our agreement.

We are in a pandemic. We lose people every day.

These are not numbers. They are not statistics. These are persons, with families, with friends and colleagues that are all affected as well.

Pharmaceutical companies, vaccine developers, have moral, societal and contractual responsibilities, which they need to uphold.

The view that the company is not obliged to deliver because we signed a ‘best effort' agreement is neither correct nor is it acceptable.

We signed an Advance Purchase Agreement for a product which at the time did not exist, and which still today is not yet authorised. And we signed it precisely to ensure that the company builds the manufacturing capacity to produce the vaccine early, so that they can deliver a certain volume of doses the day that it is authorised.

The logic of these agreements was as valid then as it is now: we provide a de-risking investment up front, in order to get a binding commitment from the company to pre-produce, even before it gets authorisation.

Not being able to ensure manufacturing capacity is against the letter and the spirit of our agreement.

We reject the logic of first come, first served. That may work at the neighbourhood butchers, but not in contracts. And not in our Advance Purchase Agreements.

There's no priority clause in the Advance Purchase Agreement.

And there's also no hierarchy of the four production plants named in the Advance Purchase Agreement. Two are located in the EU and two are located in UK.

We intend to defend the integrity of our investments and the taxpayers' money that has been invested.

We remain always open to engage with the company to resolve any outstanding issues in the spirit of true collaboration and responsibility.

That was always the spirit of our engagement with vaccine manufacturers since last spring.

This evening, at 18:30, the Steering Board will convene again.

I call on AstraZeneca to engage fully, to rebuild trust, to provide complete information and to live up to its contractual, societal and moral obligations.

Thank you very much.

Do you really think that the UK will give vaccine, which it is legally entitled to, to the EU to reduce its mortality rates which by definition means increasing UK mortality rates?

Good luck with that, you screwed up and you're pissing into the wind.

Fail.

The EU aren't asking the UK to give them its vaccines, they're asking AstraZeneca.

[Hoonercat]

So in a nutshell, the UK insisted that Astrazeneca UK-produced vac's will only go to the UK, up to the point where the order is met = that's fine.
EU threaten to do the same = uproar.

"Do the same"
NO

The UK made an AGREEMENT with the maker of the vaccine for exclusivity for one of its production lines.
The EU are looking to FORCE the vaccine maker to not export any of their product from the EU.

Great, thanks for telling me what I already knew. My point was that it amounts to the same thing - stopping exports of the vaccine until the 'host' country has had its order filled. But you knew that.
The hypocrisy of Johnson is beyond belief.

[irie]

Remarks by Commissioner Stella Kyriakides on vaccines today.

https://ec.europa.eu/commission/pressco ... ECH_21_267

Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen.

Blah blah blah

The EU aren't asking the UK to give them its vaccines, they're asking AstraZeneca.

By all accounts the UK has legally enforceable title, for which it has paid*, to vaccine produced in the UK on its behalf by Astrazeneca.

For the avoidance of doubt, this means that Astrazeneca does not have legal title to vaccines it produces in the UK thus can not sell them to a third party**.

hth

* the consideration.

** without prior express written permission to do so.

[DefTrap]

By all accounts the UK has legally enforceable title, for which it has paid*, to vaccine produced in the UK on its behalf by Astrazeneca.

For the avoidance of doubt, this means that Astrazeneca does not have legal title to vaccines it produces in the UK thus can not sell them to a third party**.

hth

* the consideration.

** without prior express written permission to do so.

I think we all know what the UK government thinks about contracts.

[Docca]

I’m saddened but not surprised that the typical mentality of the pro-brexit mob; of a move away from unity and collaboration and ‘take back control’ of sovereignty...are the very same hand-wringers gleefully wallowing in the current state as it somehow exemplifies why we left Europe.

Europe didn’t close its doors on sharing the Pfizer vaccine to the UK. We are not talking about winning, or point scoring or one-upmanship - but human lives and livelihoods during a global disaster. Have some compassion for fucks sake.

[irie]

I’m saddened but not surprised that the typical mentality of the pro-brexit mob; of a move away from unity and collaboration and ‘take back control’ of sovereignty...are the very same hand-wringers gleefully wallowing in the current state as it somehow exemplifies why we left Europe.

Europe didn’t close its doors on sharing the Pfizer vaccine to the UK. We are not talking about winning, or point scoring or one-upmanship - but human lives and livelihoods during a global disaster. Have some compassion for fucks sake.

"Europe", by which one assumes you mean the EU, has absolutely nothing to do with the UK's contract for vaccine supply which was with Pfizer/BioNtech, an American/German commercial pharmaceutical company.

As for "unity and collaboration", if the UK had gone along with the EU's purchasing strategy it would have been in the same position as EU countries currently are. Namely, much lower vaccination levels and, in the future, higher UK death rates.

But hey, let's share the deaths equally around, shall we? Or maybe not? Your call.

[Mr. Dazzle]

So...should the UK keep on vaccinating everyone down to young adults with our vaccines while elderly people in other countries go without?

What about vaccinating UK 55 year olds while French front line doctors aren't jabbed?

I dunno the answer to that BTW. Do you? Ignore what the contracts say.

[weeksy]

So...should the UK keep on vaccinating everyone down to young adults with our vaccines while elderly people in other countries go without?

What about vaccinating UK 55 year olds while French front line doctors aren't jabbed?

I dunno the answer to that BTW. Do you? Ignore what the contracts say.

Thankfully I don't have to make decisions like that. I don't envy anyone who does

[Docca]

I quite like the JCVI approach; 9 top tier risk groups. Get those done in each country first then focus on the least vulnerable. I don’t see how anyone can argue from an ethical stance that an otherwise fit and well 40yo UK male should get priority over a French pensioner or Italian paramedic etc.

[Wreckless Rat]

So it’s ok to scoff where Boris fucked up and crow about how well the EU done. Suck it up Boris is a cu’nt etc.

Yet when it’s the other way, ie Boris done the right thing and the EU fucked up, it’s somehow Boris being a cu’nt.

When crowing about Brexit and petty rules meaning lorry drivers are getting their pack lunch taken from them it’s”tough shit, rules are rules, this is what they voted for” and yet when it’s contracts that the EU fucked up on its no longer “rules are rules” and Boris is a cu’nt.

The EU loves petty rules and contracts. It has its best endeavours contracts, which would appear to be hardly worth the paper they are written on.

We have heard at great length how shit the UK is with COVID response, and when they do get something right, they are supposed to wave that and hand it over to the EU who have proved they are willing to be as petty and spiteful to the UK as they can over brexit. The 100,000 people no longer matter it seems - odd only yesterday it was a massive issue.

[Wreckless Rat]

Oh and all those who have banged on about the UK being the WORST European country etc, will crow like fuck if Boris now allows legally contracted UK supplies to go abroad, while people are still dying in the uk. That will be politically suicidal and the media will be full of “Boris SELLS OUR VACCINE STOCKS” murdering bastard etc etc etc

[DEADPOOL]

Great, thanks for telling me what I already knew. My point was that it amounts to the same thing - stopping exports of the vaccine until the 'host' country has had its order filled. But you knew that.
The hypocrisy of Johnson is beyond belief.

I can't accept that criticism as valid. Charity begins at home and our prime minister has a care of duty towards his electorate first, then, when we have the spare capacity, our friends and neighbours. We are still one of the largest donors for foreign aid (I think that's right??).

When the order was placed it was literally a shot in the dark. I recall Boris being criticised at the time for diving into the unknown with this new, unproven technology. If the Oxford virus had been a dud or impossible to produce in the required volume (that might even now be the case) do you think the EU would have said "don't worry, you can have some of ours".

I think it's a dreadful situation but the EU decided to play it safe and took its time considering its options. Had the Oxford vaccine proved troublesome, they would have had plenty of time to switch to a different supplier. I seem to recall Boris at the time praising the British/Oxford team and basically putting his faith (and our money) into their development efforts.

In the real world, things can get so fucked up there is no "best" solution, only the least worst. I say Boris is doing a great job. I certainly wouldn't want to do it.

[Wreckless Rat]

It also makes ethical sense to deliver most vaccine to the worst affected European country.

Why is Missus Miggins of Hull worth less than Mr Alonso of Rome......

[cheb]

Why only Europe, why not the rest of the world? Bit tricky having to factor in the harshness of someone's life and how much it has aged them, not all 30 year old are equal.

We all make decisions like this every time we have more than we need and don't send our excess time, money or resources to those in the rest of the world with less. The only reason that this has been focused on now is because of the stupid tribalism of leave/remain. And both sides have poisonous fanatics who revel in petty point scoring.

[DefTrap]

So...should the UK keep on vaccinating everyone down to young adults with our vaccines while elderly people in other countries go without?

What about vaccinating UK 55 year olds while French front line doctors aren't jabbed?

I dunno the answer to that BTW.

I think answer is pretty obvious.
We're not talking about fishing quotas any more.

[cheb]

So...should the UK keep on vaccinating everyone down to young adults with our vaccines while elderly people in other countries go without?

What about vaccinating UK 55 year olds while French front line doctors aren't jabbed?

I dunno the answer to that BTW.

I think answer is pretty obvious.
We're not talking about fishing quotas any more.

If it's obvious then state it plainly.

[DEADPOOL]

I appreciate the 100k covid death is both a horrifying figure relating to a horrible situation but it is still merely a statistic.

Another statistic is "excess death rate". The difference between the current number of deaths and the average based on time of year. Looking at that statistic, the UK did pretty badly in April, more than double the expected number of deaths (not as bad as Spain during the same period). I have not cross referenced percentage excess with the actual number during April which one assumes might be quite low anyway.

Thing is, I can't quite understand how the UK can be so much worse than the rest of Europe when our excess death rate was sort of mid table in December. Almost as if a similar excessive number of people are dying in the rest of Europe but not being reported as Covid specific....

ourworldindata.png (203.64 KiB) Viewed 1111 times

Have a play with it yourself at ourworldindata.org

I have been a bit cheeky and chopped off January because some of the "comparable" countries are missing, plus I have a narrative to supprt.