Would you have an electric car if you had the money for a new car and were in the market for one?

[Nordboy]

*assuming you can charge at home.

And are in the market for an equivalently priced car

Indeed.

The initial outlay, the depreciation over an ICE car and the other running costs (less to service outweighed by quicker tyre wear, etc.) means it's not so black and white.

Buying 2nd hand makes a big difference tho'

Yep, I've had a big think about buying new, leasing or used and I'm finding it hard to stomach the depreciation on a new car, leasing reduces this a bit, but essentially you're still paying the depreciation. So, I'm thinking used is the way to go at the moment. When you see year old EV's at 50% of their new cost it's hard to decide otherwise for me?

[KungFooBob]

I was tempted by a used, six month old Polestar 2 Long Range Dual Motor, with Pilot and plus Packs for £35k.

New they're £53k.

The wife didn't like it tho'

Yeah the 0% PCP and deposit contribution on the new ones makes a big difference, but if you've got the cash in the bank and plan to keep it for a while 2nd hand makes more sense, imho

My M50 was £36k, three years old with 25k on the clock. I priced one up with all the options on the BMW configurator and it came out over £70k.

I reckon it's got enough performance and toys to keep me interested for three-four years.

EDIT:

Imagine how much of a bargain the R5 is going to be in two-three years when they all get handed back to the dealers at the end of the PCP deals!

[Mr. Dazzle]

Imagine how much of a bargain the R5 is going to be in two-three years when they all get handed back to the dealers at the end of the PCP deals!

I am doing exactly that.

Mrs D is making noises about not liking her shit wagon and wanting a new car. She's much less than 50/50 at the moment, by the time she's up to 70/30 there should be loads of cheap R5s.

[MrLongbeard]

Buying 2nd hand makes a big difference tho'

For sure.
Given the 2nd prices of ICE cars a gently used Polestar isn't that ridiculous, but getting a 'charger' fitted would run me to more than a years worth of diesel

[Count Steer]

Imagine how much of a bargain the R5 is going to be in two-three years when they all get handed back to the dealers at the end of the PCP deals!

I am doing exactly that.

Mrs D is making noises about not liking her shit wagon and wanting a new car. She's much less than 50/50 at the moment, by the time she's up to 70/30 there should be loads of cheap R5s.

If they go down 50% in 3 years they'll be cheap as chips!

I was surprised how low the new price is tbh.

The Alpine is a bit of a steep uplift in price though.

[KungFooBob]

Buying 2nd hand makes a big difference tho'

For sure.
Given the 2nd prices of ICE cars a gently used Polestar isn't that ridiculous, but getting a 'charger' fitted would run me to more than a years worth of diesel

A three pin plug gives you 2kWh, if you have a car capable of 4miles/kwh, that's 6-7 miles an hour after charging loses.

8 hours of overnight charging will give you 50-60 miles of range.

On a normal tariff that's 20-30p a kwh (£4), on an overnight EV tariff it's 7p a kwh (£1.12).

You only need a proper 7kwh home charger if you're doing over 50 miles a day.

[MrLongbeard]

You only need a proper 7kwh home charger if you're doing over 50 miles a day.

And that's where it doesn't work for me, or I / my driving needs don't work for EV's.
I don't need a car every day, but once a week I will do just shy of 200 miles sometimes more, theoretically I could do a Taipan and granny charge it over the week for that one day, but it'd leave me high and dry if I need a second day's use in the week, which although not common it's often enough.

[Mr. Dazzle]

You only need a proper 7kwh home charger if you're doing over 50 miles a day.

And you can't blag it at work

I was surprised how low the new price is tbh.

If you don't really follow the moves of the industry you probably wouldn't be aware that the cost of EVs (in terms of production) is now very close to that of ICE. They'll be at parity soon, and then believe it or not, EVs will be cheaper to produce than ICE. They've got fewer bits after all.

Things like that Mega Merc ^^^ etc skew it becuase they're packed with brand new tech, but at the other end of the scale 'normal' cars like the R5 are becoming pretty sensible.

One of the big things in the UK which effects the prices is just residuals, many of which are informed by things Everybody Knows™ which aren't true. Like how the batteries die after 2 years, there are only 18 chargers in the UK or parasitic losses mean you can't park for more than 12 minutes....which we've seen here, isn't the case. Consumer understanding and sentiment is just behind reality.

[Count Steer]

Seems pretty obvs really. If you don't currently spend a lot on fuel, you're not going to save a lot by buying an electric car. In fact, if you buy a new one/go PCP/pay for charger installation/use public chargers etc you're not going to save anything, more likely it'll cost you.

Funny how cost and savings get important where electric is concerned when people frequently change their ICE car just because they want a newer/faster/different one though.

Lots of households have 2 cars and my plan is to swap the hybrid shopping trolley for electric at some point. Probably a couple of years time. Tempted to swap mine for something like the Q e-trons mentioned above though. Not driven by fuel costs/savings at all - I fill mine every 2 months and use the little one locally. Might ask for an electric as courtesy car next time mine's serviced just for an all day road test.

PS According to Which, 1 in 5 new vehicle registrations were electric in the previous year in the UK. (Not sure if that's calendar year or a rolling 12 months).

[wheelnut]

And that's where it doesn't work for me, or I / my driving needs don't work for EV's.
I don't need a car every day, but once a week I will do just shy of 200 miles sometimes more, theoretically I could do a Taipan and granny charge it over the week for that one day, but it'd leave me high and dry if I need a second day's use in the week, which although not common it's often enough.

I've got the 7kwh charger and it gives me about 40% charge between 00:30 and 05:30 which is the time frame i get it at 7p.

You do have to think about it a little bit if you have an upcoming long trip but it hasn't been an issue so far.

[Mussels]

You only need a proper 7kwh home charger if you're doing over 50 miles a day.

And you can't blag it at work

I was surprised how low the new price is tbh.

If you don't really follow the moves of the industry you probably wouldn't be aware that the cost of EVs (in terms of production) is now very close to that of ICE. They'll be at parity soon, and then believe it or not, EVs will be cheaper to produce than ICE. They've got fewer bits after all.

Things like that Mega Merc ^^^ etc skew it becuase they're packed with brand new tech, but at the other end of the scale 'normal' cars like the R5 are becoming pretty sensible.

One of the big things in the UK which effects the prices is just residuals, many of which are informed by things Everybody Knows™ which aren't true. Like how the batteries die after 2 years, there are only 18 chargers in the UK or parasitic losses mean you can't park for more than 12 minutes....which we've seen here, isn't the case. Consumer understanding and sentiment is just behind reality.

You're dragging up old arguments that were fairly accurate at the time even though you argued they weren't. Residuals are now suffering because cars going into the 2nd hand market now were very expensive when new with sales driven by tax breaks.
When I need a new car I'll consider EVs but right now I don't think they offer much more than virtue signalling.

[Taipan]

Buying 2nd hand makes a big difference tho'

For sure.
Given the 2nd prices of ICE cars a gently used Polestar isn't that ridiculous, but getting a 'charger' fitted would run me to more than a years worth of diesel

Depends on your usage. I was in for a oHme charger which came out at best part of a grand supplied and fitted. They cancelled the installation for fear of asbestos in my roofing panel. So I used the granny charger (3 pin plug charger) and have continued to ever since and it works out well. Turns out I can have a charger fitted but i have no need due to my low usage.If. you work from home a lot, you could probably do the same and supplement it with the occasional supercharger.

Just looked at my MPGe!


combo duplicate remover

[MrLongbeard]

Yeah more thinking to be done, more fag packet scratching needed.
For my use case it's not about saving the planet or saving money, I just fancy a new car, but do need to justify (to myself at least) the initial outlay, which is a big departure from my usual habits where due to hating selling vehicles and dealing with the public, I tend to keep them until they are written off or the engine explodes.

I think I'll revisit it when I know what's happening with work as that's up in the air at the mo.

[Saga Lout]

...

BTW for anyone wondering, the 24 hour distance record for an ICE is 3000 miles (400 miles less than this EV), also held by Mercedes. Hasn't been contested for a while though.

I was wondering. I did some Googling.

"The first application of the Volkswagen W12 was the 2001 Volkswagen W12, a mid-engined concept car which set the 24‑hour world endurance record in 2001 with a distance of 7,085.7 kilometres (4,402.8 mi) and an average speed of 295 km/h (183 mph)." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volkswage ... -12_engine

i.e. almost 1,000 miles more than the EV.

And ChatGPT: "The all-time ICE car distance record during the famed Le Mans 24‑hour race stands at 5,410.713 km (approx. 3,363 miles). This was achieved in 2010 by the Audi R15 TDI Plus, driven by Timo Bernhard, Romain Dumas, and Mike Rockenfeller"

i.e.during a race and only 41 miles short of the EV's ideal conditions distance.

[Mr. Dazzle]

When I looked it up the Mercedes C111 diesel held the record, dating back to the 70s. Also why this new Merc EV is painted orange.

It's just not a hotly contested field for ICE cars because it's a bit of a non event.

[Count Steer]

When I looked it up the Mercedes C111 diesel held the record, dating back to the 70s. Also why this new Merc EV is painted orange.

It's just not a hotly contested field for ICE cars because it's a bit of a non event.

It's interesting, but not very 'real world'...although a version of the V12 made it into a couple of 'daily driver' models.

[Saga Lout]

The EV Charger Hack That Can Burn Down Your House Just Got More Terrifying

"If you have one of the vulnerable EV chargers, a hacker across the world could reach in and set it on fire. The same is true for a theoretically safe charger that's defective or that has been modified."

[Taipan]

FYI; I put my car on charge earlier. I tell Octopus what time I need the car by, and it works out a schedule to get it charged on time. As you'll see, although my cheap rate is midnight to 7, it'll apply the cheap rate outside of those hours if need be.

[KungFooBob]

New world record, 4.2!

The app tells you the average of owners of the same model in the same country, which is 3.1.

Did I mention that I've now done 800 miles charging for free

[Mr. Dazzle]

You did the whole journey in Eco Pro?

*Uncontrollable retching noises*