I was thinking similar. Seems an obvious solution.MrLongbeard wrote: ↑Sat Mar 16, 2024 12:00 pm Given the delays in handover times when dropping off at A&E the solution is simple, just jack the ambos in to a fast charger when they rock up at the hospital.
Would you have an electric car if you had the money for a new car and were in the market for one?
- Yorick
- Posts: 16278
- Joined: Sat Mar 14, 2020 8:20 pm
- Location: Paradise
- Has thanked: 10113 times
- Been thanked: 6649 times
Re: Would you have an electric car if you had the money for a new car and were in the market for one?
- Yambo
- Posts: 2448
- Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2020 8:08 pm
- Location: Self Isolating
- Has thanked: 614 times
- Been thanked: 1632 times
Re: Would you have an electric car if you had the money for a new car and were in the market for one?
Mr. Dazzle wrote: ↑Sat Mar 16, 2024 11:21 amRed Herring IMO.
There doesn't have to be a particularly long power cut to cripple any kind of ambulance service. Even something as simple as getting fuel from the pumps requires electricity. The dispatch systems won't work without power. You can't charge all your machines which go "bing!".
Not to mention the fact Hospitals use an awful lot of electricity themselves. Which is why we have UPSs and a generally very reliable electricity grid.
If electricity is that critical then I guess they'll have a generator on hand that kicks in automatically when there's a power cut. We have lots of power cuts here so all the hotels, a lot of the restaurants and some households have a back-up generator. I thought about getting one myself but I don't really need it. Surely hospitals will have back up generators (ICE powered of course . . . )
It used to be the case that fuel pumps had a manual system as well as electric pumps. I've used them.
But I wasn't talking about power cuts, I was just musing about charging time as opposed to refueling time.
- Horse
- Posts: 11215
- Joined: Sun Mar 15, 2020 11:30 am
- Location: Always sunny southern England
- Has thanked: 5945 times
- Been thanked: 4928 times
Re: Would you have an electric car if you had the money for a new car and were in the market for one?
So obvious that ...Yorick wrote: ↑Sat Mar 16, 2024 12:05 pmI was thinking similar. Seems an obvious solution.MrLongbeard wrote: ↑Sat Mar 16, 2024 12:00 pm Given the delays in handover times when dropping off at A&E the solution is simple, just jack the ambos in to a fast charger when they rock up at the hospital.
Even bland can be a type of character
-
- Posts: 13486
- Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2020 7:57 pm
- Location: Milton Keynes
- Has thanked: 2610 times
- Been thanked: 6013 times
Re: Would you have an electric car if you had the money for a new car and were in the market for one?
Thus also solving any power cut concerns. Any big hospital has a UPS system for such eventualities.
I actually helped make a bunch of the hardware for one of the London hopsital ones. They replaced loads of massive lead acid batteries with ultra high speed glass/carbon flywheels. We called them the Mach 3 flywheels, cause that's how fast the edges went. Well...they ran in a vacuum, but you see what I mean.
Batteries/flywheels can do uninterrupted power for sort of 15-20 mins while the diesel generators fire up.
I actually helped make a bunch of the hardware for one of the London hopsital ones. They replaced loads of massive lead acid batteries with ultra high speed glass/carbon flywheels. We called them the Mach 3 flywheels, cause that's how fast the edges went. Well...they ran in a vacuum, but you see what I mean.
Batteries/flywheels can do uninterrupted power for sort of 15-20 mins while the diesel generators fire up.
- Horse
- Posts: 11215
- Joined: Sun Mar 15, 2020 11:30 am
- Location: Always sunny southern England
- Has thanked: 5945 times
- Been thanked: 4928 times
Re: Would you have an electric car if you had the money for a new car and were in the market for one?
Off on a temporary tangent. Did they have a heavy outer ring? Just thinking that a flywheel needs mass to be effective?Mr. Dazzle wrote: ↑Sat Mar 16, 2024 12:24 pm Thus also solving any power cut concerns. Aultra high speed glass/carbon flywheels. We called them the Mach 3 flywheels,
Even bland can be a type of character
-
- Posts: 13486
- Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2020 7:57 pm
- Location: Milton Keynes
- Has thanked: 2610 times
- Been thanked: 6013 times
Re: Would you have an electric car if you had the money for a new car and were in the market for one?
It's needs kinetic energy in this context (energy storage)...traditional obtained by spinning a heavy thing slowly, but it's actually more effective to spin a light thing fast. V squared innit.
Just much more technically challenging!
Just much more technically challenging!
- Taipan
- Posts: 13258
- Joined: Sat Mar 14, 2020 1:48 pm
- Location: Essex Riviera!
- Has thanked: 15604 times
- Been thanked: 9849 times
Re: Would you have an electric car if you had the money for a new car and were in the market for one?
Or stop wasting time with slow handovers. Open back doors, Reverse at speed. Hit brakes...MrLongbeard wrote: ↑Sat Mar 16, 2024 12:00 pm Given the delays in handover times when dropping off at A&E the solution is simple, just jack the ambos in to a fast charger when they rock up at the hospital.
- Horse
- Posts: 11215
- Joined: Sun Mar 15, 2020 11:30 am
- Location: Always sunny southern England
- Has thanked: 5945 times
- Been thanked: 4928 times
Re: Would you have an electric car if you had the money for a new car and were in the market for one?
Regen braking - puts power in the batteryTaipan wrote: ↑Sat Mar 16, 2024 12:47 pmHit brakes...MrLongbeard wrote: ↑Sat Mar 16, 2024 12:00 pm Given the delays in handover times when dropping off at A&E the solution is simple, just jack the ambos in to a fast charger when they rock up at the hospital.
Win-Win!
Even bland can be a type of character
Re: Would you have an electric car if you had the money for a new car and were in the market for one?
I'm in the market right now and I would have an electric car......if I liked any of them. I've had a really good look and i just don't. I think maybe it needs another 4-5 yrs to get enough choice
So I think the next ICE car will be the last one of those we'll buy. Although I'm struggling to find man of those I like, it's wall to wall boring grey SUVs
So I think the next ICE car will be the last one of those we'll buy. Although I'm struggling to find man of those I like, it's wall to wall boring grey SUVs
- Taipan
- Posts: 13258
- Joined: Sat Mar 14, 2020 1:48 pm
- Location: Essex Riviera!
- Has thanked: 15604 times
- Been thanked: 9849 times
Re: Would you have an electric car if you had the money for a new car and were in the market for one?
Happened across an Aussie reel where they talk about real world ranges as found by What Car magazine. This is an issue that comes up often. Do car manufacturers lie as badly about ice ranges?
Another interesting point they make, is if the range is that much less than the manufacturers claims, then they are recharging more, which is another knock of the EVs green credentials.
As a household I'd guess at 90% of our trips being local and range wouldn't really be an issue for us and I would like a leccy bike and car, but I cant see that happening for some time yet and i get a sense of relief that I didnt buy the Tesla i was intending too. I just get the feeling the whole EV thing is hype, smoke and mirrors. But, as someone that developed LOA (late onset asthma) it would certainly suit me if every car in London was a EV as the immediate air would be lot cleaner, whatever the bigger picture is...
Another interesting point they make, is if the range is that much less than the manufacturers claims, then they are recharging more, which is another knock of the EVs green credentials.
As a household I'd guess at 90% of our trips being local and range wouldn't really be an issue for us and I would like a leccy bike and car, but I cant see that happening for some time yet and i get a sense of relief that I didnt buy the Tesla i was intending too. I just get the feeling the whole EV thing is hype, smoke and mirrors. But, as someone that developed LOA (late onset asthma) it would certainly suit me if every car in London was a EV as the immediate air would be lot cleaner, whatever the bigger picture is...
-
- Posts: 13486
- Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2020 7:57 pm
- Location: Milton Keynes
- Has thanked: 2610 times
- Been thanked: 6013 times
Re: Would you have an electric car if you had the money for a new car and were in the market for one?
Of course they do, everyone knows they do and they expect it. It's just that it's quoted in terms of MPG, rather than range.
- Horse
- Posts: 11215
- Joined: Sun Mar 15, 2020 11:30 am
- Location: Always sunny southern England
- Has thanked: 5945 times
- Been thanked: 4928 times
Re: Would you have an electric car if you had the money for a new car and were in the market for one?
Is there a standard EV test, like the ICE rolling road 'urban cycle'?Mr. Dazzle wrote: ↑Sun Mar 17, 2024 10:17 amOf course they do, everyone knows they do and they expect it. It's just that it's quoted in terms of MPG, rather than range.
Even bland can be a type of character
-
- Posts: 13486
- Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2020 7:57 pm
- Location: Milton Keynes
- Has thanked: 2610 times
- Been thanked: 6013 times
Re: Would you have an electric car if you had the money for a new car and were in the market for one?
Yeah there are WLTP tests for the official range/economy just like with ICE engines.
The real numbers typically aren't rolling roaded AFAIK. Lots of rolling road testing happens of course, but IIRC your official numbers have to come from a real "full test" car, I'm not sure.
https://evdb.nz/wltp
The real numbers typically aren't rolling roaded AFAIK. Lots of rolling road testing happens of course, but IIRC your official numbers have to come from a real "full test" car, I'm not sure.
https://evdb.nz/wltp
Last edited by Mr. Dazzle on Sun Mar 17, 2024 10:40 am, edited 1 time in total.
-
- Posts: 3803
- Joined: Sat Jul 17, 2021 12:34 am
- Has thanked: 465 times
- Been thanked: 1372 times
Re: Would you have an electric car if you had the money for a new car and were in the market for one?
85mpg one say say i should get on a run with the wifes DS3. Sitting at 70 returned 59 tops. I am more than happy with that as the last car was 36 ish.Mr. Dazzle wrote: ↑Sun Mar 17, 2024 10:17 amOf course they do, everyone knows they do and they expect it. It's just that it's quoted in terms of MPG, rather than range.
- Taipan
- Posts: 13258
- Joined: Sat Mar 14, 2020 1:48 pm
- Location: Essex Riviera!
- Has thanked: 15604 times
- Been thanked: 9849 times
Re: Would you have an electric car if you had the money for a new car and were in the market for one?
Up to 40% off according to that test. To my mind that's pretty scandalous!Mr. Dazzle wrote: ↑Sun Mar 17, 2024 10:17 amOf course they do, everyone knows they do and they expect it. It's just that it's quoted in terms of MPG, rather than range.
-
- Posts: 13486
- Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2020 7:57 pm
- Location: Milton Keynes
- Has thanked: 2610 times
- Been thanked: 6013 times
Re: Would you have an electric car if you had the money for a new car and were in the market for one?
It's because "range" is actually quite a complicated term.
When i filled my diesel car up last week the dash said I had ~550 miles in the tank. I drove 40 miles to work and it then said I had 750 miles. I "gained" 200 miles of range while also driving 40...how does that work? Is that scandalous. If it had been the other way around, and the range had dropped from 700 to 500 (because I'd gone from motorway to urban, rather than vice versa) would I have grounds to complain?
Of course, its because the efficiency of the car changes enormously depending on the type of driving I'm doing. So it is with EVs, but to a smaller degree.
Trying to say a car has a "range of X" is almost a meaningless question. It depends massively on how you use it. But we're now in the place where people expect a single value from an EV manufacturer and equally want to say "aha! Gotcha!" when that enormously simplified value is wrong.
My car does a genuine 70mpg on the motorway. If the manufacture said it does that all the time you'd cry BS, and rightly so. Why do you expect different from another fuel/technology?
When i filled my diesel car up last week the dash said I had ~550 miles in the tank. I drove 40 miles to work and it then said I had 750 miles. I "gained" 200 miles of range while also driving 40...how does that work? Is that scandalous. If it had been the other way around, and the range had dropped from 700 to 500 (because I'd gone from motorway to urban, rather than vice versa) would I have grounds to complain?
Of course, its because the efficiency of the car changes enormously depending on the type of driving I'm doing. So it is with EVs, but to a smaller degree.
Trying to say a car has a "range of X" is almost a meaningless question. It depends massively on how you use it. But we're now in the place where people expect a single value from an EV manufacturer and equally want to say "aha! Gotcha!" when that enormously simplified value is wrong.
My car does a genuine 70mpg on the motorway. If the manufacture said it does that all the time you'd cry BS, and rightly so. Why do you expect different from another fuel/technology?
- Horse
- Posts: 11215
- Joined: Sun Mar 15, 2020 11:30 am
- Location: Always sunny southern England
- Has thanked: 5945 times
- Been thanked: 4928 times
Re: Would you have an electric car if you had the money for a new car and were in the market for one?
'Up to'? Hmm terrible. Scandalous even. Is that what you're saying? Agreed? OK, let's continueTaipan wrote: ↑Sun Mar 17, 2024 10:41 amUp to 40% off according to that test. To my mind that's pretty scandalous!Mr. Dazzle wrote: ↑Sun Mar 17, 2024 10:17 amOf course they do, everyone knows they do and they expect it. It's just that it's quoted in terms of MPG, rather than range.
One British company, Emissions Analytics, has tested over 800 vehicles over the last decade covering a wide range of makes, models and engine types. Its Equa Index also enables the company to forecast fuel economy for cars it hasn’t yet tested.
The company’s tests have found that the average car’s fuel economy is 25% lower than official NEDC numbers, with some vehicles as much as 40% below the laboratory figure.
Oh deary deary me ...
Even bland can be a type of character
- Yorick
- Posts: 16278
- Joined: Sat Mar 14, 2020 8:20 pm
- Location: Paradise
- Has thanked: 10113 times
- Been thanked: 6649 times
Re: Would you have an electric car if you had the money for a new car and were in the market for one?
Just found this thread...electric? Yes please. Why? A mate travels the country most days, around 270 miles a day. ... and has a tesla p85d variant. It's quite old now and has done about 175000 miles.
His contention is that range anxiety is suffered by people who don't have electric cars. He will stop once a day for half an hour which gives him 80% charge.
More to the point it has 720bhp. It's fucking insane. We have an arrangement where if I'm anywhere near Huddersfield he drinks and I drive so I've played with this thing enough times to know that without any shadow of doubt I'd seriously enjoy having one.
His contention is that range anxiety is suffered by people who don't have electric cars. He will stop once a day for half an hour which gives him 80% charge.
More to the point it has 720bhp. It's fucking insane. We have an arrangement where if I'm anywhere near Huddersfield he drinks and I drive so I've played with this thing enough times to know that without any shadow of doubt I'd seriously enjoy having one.
Re: Would you have an electric car if you had the money for a new car and were in the market for one?
It's not scandalous though, and nobody's to blame, especially not the manufacturers as it's nothing to do with them. The test is a standard European one that they are legally obliged to do. Sure, it's not very accurate in the real world, same as the equivalent ICE economy one often isn't.
It's an imperfect world
The question really is whether the real-world range is enough for what you/whoever need it for.