In todays news...

[Cousin Jack]

To be fair to the Palestinians, maybe the Arab side should have won the 1948 war, or subsequent wars.

To be totally fair to the Palestinians, Balfour should have kept his mouth shut. Politicians should not promise to give away stuff that does not belong to them.

[Cousin Jack]

Hamas is probsbly about 1% of Palestinians

They are in control of more than 1% of Palestinians in Gaza.

A man with a Kalashnikov can control a fair number of unarmed people.

[JackyJoll]

To be fair to the Palestinians, maybe the Arab side should have won the 1948 war, or subsequent wars.

To be totally fair to the Palestinians, Balfour should have kept his mouth shut. Politicians should not promise to give away stuff that does not belong to them.

In 1917, any minister in any government would make promises and even tell lies, to avoid losing the First World War.

[wheelnut]

l
As I said, I don’t like it.

What would you do if you were Israel, after 7th October 2023?

If I were Israel I would have negotiated a 2 state solution long ago. 7th October would just be another day.

Now it has happened it is even more urgent to agree a compromise, or it will happen again.

You’re assuming Hamas want a two state solution. That’s an awfully big assumption.

[ZRX61]

In 1917, any minister in any government would make promises and even tell lies, to avoid losing the First World War.

Isn't it about fucking time WWI ended? We've been fighting it for 110 years FFS

[irie]

l
As I said, I don’t like it.

What would you do if you were Israel, after 7th October 2023?

If I were Israel I would have negotiated a 2 state solution long ago. 7th October would just be another day.

Now it has happened it is even more urgent to agree a compromise, or it will happen again.

You’re assuming Hamas want a two state solution. That’s an awfully big assumption.

Hamas absolutely does NOT want a two state solution!

Preamble
...
Palestine is a land that was seized by a racist, anti-human and colonial Zionist project that was founded on a false promise (the Balfour Declaration), on recognition of a usurping entity and on imposing a fait accompli by force.

Palestine symbolises the resistance that shall continue until liberation is accomplished, until the return is fulfilled and until a fully sovereign state is established with Jerusalem as its capital.
...

Until and unless Iran withdraws its support for Hamas (and its Covenant), Hezbollah, and its other terrorist proxies, it is obvious that there can never be a two state solution, negotiated or otherwise.

Israel would also have to withdraw to its pre-1967 borders and in addition remove all settlements (about 250) from the West Bank.

[JackyJoll]

In 1917, any minister in any government would make promises and even tell lies, to avoid losing the First World War.

Isn't it about fucking time WWI ended? We've been fighting it for 110 years FFS

Er… yes.

[Yambo]

I think it was Golda Meir who used to delight in telling people that she had held a Palestinian passport and was at one point, a Palestinian.

Personally . . .

It's a family squabble, they're all basically related so we should just let them get on with it.

There's now't as queer as family.

[Demannu]

Apparently we have 10 years until singularity (unless we blow ourselves up first).
I'm taking no chances and being nice to Alexa!

[irie]

I think it was Golda Meir who used to delight in telling people that she had held a Palestinian passport and was at one point, a Palestinian.

Personally . . .

It's a family squabble, they're all basically related so we should just let them get on with it.

There's now't as queer as family.

And keep it in the Middle East.

We have spent centuries dividing Church and state thereby asserting the primacy of secular law as the foundation of our democracy.

The central tenet of Islam is the primacy of religious law over secular law.

Therein lies the irreconcilable conflict between the teachings of Islam and the central foundation of our democracy.

Millions in the Islamic world do not believe in free speech, freedom of religion, democracy, a secular state, free enterprise, and human rights, but these are precisely the principles which are the basic foundations of our Western Democracies.

[JackyJoll]

I just listened to the two minute silence, to hear if anyone shouted about Alan’s snackbar or whatever.

[Cousin Jack]

We have spent centuries dividing Church and state thereby asserting the primacy of secular law as the foundation of our democracy.

The central tenet of Islam is the primacy of religious law over secular law.

Therein lies the irreconcilable conflict between the teachings of Islam and the central foundation of our democracy.

Millions in the Islamic world do not believe in free speech, freedom of religion, democracy, a secular state, free enterprise, and human rights, but these are precisely the principles which are the basic foundations of our Western Democracies.

I would agree that most of the religious leaders of Islam do not agree with most of our freedoms. Some of our Christian religious leaders don't either.

That does not mean that your average punter, Chtistian, Moslem, or any other flavour, wants to be ruled by a theocracy, even one of his choice. Most want to get on with their life, without god-botherers interfering.

[Yambo]

I would agree that most of the religious leaders of Islam do not agree with most of our freedoms.

Quite a lot of them don't agree with other Islamic religious leaders' interpretations of their book. Of course that's the same for the Christian boys as well but at least there's an individual at the top of that pile.

[Cousin Jack]

Quite a lot of them don't agree with other Islamic religious leaders' interpretations of their book. Of course that's the same for the Christian boys as well but at least there's an individual at the top of that pile.

Dont think our lot are 'united' at the top! More flavours of Christianity than a dog has fleas. And they dont agree on much.

[Potter]

I'm genuinely happy today to hold my hand up and say I was wrong, some of us do have the integrity to do it.

I expected a lot more trouble with 300k people on a protest march, but it appears that the vast majority were well behaved and the police did an excellent job of keeping any agitators (especially from Tommy Robinsons mob) away so there was no spark to kick it all off.

I think there was an element of terrorist supporters but I expect they were only minor sympathisers, the proper ones will keep out of sight.
So fair play, it was a largely very peaceful protest march.

[Potter]

However, I think something does need to be ironed out.

You may not be a flag waving, pillowcase wearing racist, but if you support Tommy Robinson or Jeremy Corbyn then you are at least a racist/anti-semetic sympathiser.

Corbyn is the Tommy Robinson of the Labour Party....or he was before he was banned from standing as an MP because of his warped views.
If you align yourself with Tommy Robinson, or Jeremy Corbyn, both opposite sides of the same coin, then it is aligning with known and documented extremists who are both unwelcome in any mainstream political party because of their extremist views.

I know that people from both sides will want to claim that Robinson and Corbyn aren't racist or anti-semetic, but they'd be wrong and should go on a racism/prejudice awareness course to understand just how far they are away from the sensible centre ground and how they are sympathising with hate.

[Dodgy69]

It's when you put all the animals in the same cage the problems starts and some are more tolerant than others.

[mangocrazy]

You may not be a flag waving, pillowcase wearing racist, but if you support Tommy Robinson or Jeremy Corbyn then you are at least a racist/anti-semetic sympathiser.

Corbyn is the Tommy Robinson of the Labour Party....or he was before he was banned from standing as an MP because of his warped views.
If you align yourself with Tommy Robinson, or Jeremy Corbyn, both opposite sides of the same coin, then it is aligning with known and documented extremists who are both unwelcome in any mainstream political party because of their extremist views.

I know that people from both sides will want to claim that Robinson and Corbyn aren't racist or anti-semetic, but they'd be wrong and should go on a racism/prejudice awareness course to understand just how far they are away from the sensible centre ground and how they are sympathising with hate.

Yawn... more stinky bait...

[Potter]

You may not be a flag waving, pillowcase wearing racist, but if you support Tommy Robinson or Jeremy Corbyn then you are at least a racist/anti-semetic sympathiser.

Corbyn is the Tommy Robinson of the Labour Party....or he was before he was banned from standing as an MP because of his warped views.
If you align yourself with Tommy Robinson, or Jeremy Corbyn, both opposite sides of the same coin, then it is aligning with known and documented extremists who are both unwelcome in any mainstream political party because of their extremist views.

I know that people from both sides will want to claim that Robinson and Corbyn aren't racist or anti-semetic, but they'd be wrong and should go on a racism/prejudice awareness course to understand just how far they are away from the sensible centre ground and how they are sympathising with hate.

Yawn... more stinky bait...

For anyone without a dangerous political bias, it's just fact and it needed saying.
Most of the UK public are fairly centre ground and will agree with my statement, but if you think it's bait then you're one of the people that is way off the centre ground and sympathising with an extremist banned from mainstream politics.

[ZRX61]

Quite a lot of them don't agree with other Islamic religious leaders' interpretations of their book. Of course that's the same for the Christian boys as well but at least there's an individual at the top of that pile.

I live in a town of about 150,000. We have at least 70 different christian sects, all of whom claim to have the *right* interpretation. The largest one covers 160 acres. In contrast, we have one each devoted to the Muslim, Buddhist & Hindu myths.