HS2 - Bin it off or carry on regardless?

[gremlin]

As per the title. What's your thoughts?

Much as it's soaring in price, I think crack on regardless. Our rail service is a joke in this country. My only issue is that it will allow a load of Norvern Monkeys to come down to London, bringing their skinny dogs and flat caps and moaning about the price of a pint.

[weeksy]

Our rail service is a joke in this country.

And this isn't going to help it as it'll be £150 to go 50 miles.. rail travel is not crap because it's bad... it's crap because it's insanely expensive compared to cars.

Watch progs like "race across the world" and they do 500km journeys in Spain/Portugal for £35.... try and get a ticket here on the day for £35 to do 300 miles...

That's the issue.. HS2 will only make it more expensive as the companies recoup costs.

[MrLongbeard]

Should never have been commissioned in the first place, It's the 21st century 90% of everything can be done remotely by video, highlighted by the lockdown experiences.

Why spunk many many billions of pounds on a public transport solution to shave off less than hour?

[Yorick]

Surely in 20/30 years, folk will be working from home and communicate by Zoom etc.

Will anybody be travelling to business meetings them?

[Mr. Dazzle]

Our rail service is a joke in this country.

And this isn't going to help it as it'll be £150 to go 50 miles.. rail travel is not crap because it's bad... it's crap because it's insanely expensive compared to cars.

Watch progs like "race across the world" and they do 500km journeys in Spain/Portugal for £35.... try and get a ticket here on the day for £35 to do 300 miles...

That's the issue.. HS2 will only make it more expensive as the companies recoup costs.

Rail service is massively subsidised / state run in those places though. So 'you' are still paying loads either way, it's just a question of when/where it comes out of your pocket. I don't necessarily think that's a bad thing TBF.

If "they" could just quote honestly at the start I'd be alot happier. It was fucking always gonna spiral in cost, the initial HS2 figures were just daft low. Every fucking single time. Every time. FFS. Just be honest about how much it's gonna cost at the start

[gremlin]

Our rail service is a joke in this country.

And this isn't going to help it as it'll be £150 to go 50 miles.. rail travel is not crap because it's bad... it's crap because it's insanely expensive compared to cars.

Watch progs like "race across the world" and they do 500km journeys in Spain/Portugal for £35.... try and get a ticket here on the day for £35 to do 300 miles...

That's the issue.. HS2 will only make it more expensive as the companies recoup costs.

Not gonna disagree with that. I'm a capitalist at heart, but even I think some things that are in the national interest, and benefit the country, such as a functioning rail network, should not be privately-owed.

That said, I remember British Rail, and they were hardly the halcyon days of luxury rail travel.

[weeksy]

Our rail service is a joke in this country.

And this isn't going to help it as it'll be £150 to go 50 miles.. rail travel is not crap because it's bad... it's crap because it's insanely expensive compared to cars.

Watch progs like "race across the world" and they do 500km journeys in Spain/Portugal for £35.... try and get a ticket here on the day for £35 to do 300 miles...

That's the issue.. HS2 will only make it more expensive as the companies recoup costs.

Not gonna disagree with that. I'm a capitalist at heart, but even I think some things that are in the national interest, and benefit the country, such as a functioning rail network, should not be privately-owed.

That said, I remember British Rail, and they were hardly the halcyon days of luxury rail travel.

So the only people who'll use it are company people who are getting it paid for by clients. Rather than families, couples, you know, normal day to day people.

[gremlin]

And this isn't going to help it as it'll be £150 to go 50 miles.. rail travel is not crap because it's bad... it's crap because it's insanely expensive compared to cars.

Watch progs like "race across the world" and they do 500km journeys in Spain/Portugal for £35.... try and get a ticket here on the day for £35 to do 300 miles...

That's the issue.. HS2 will only make it more expensive as the companies recoup costs.

Not gonna disagree with that. I'm a capitalist at heart, but even I think some things that are in the national interest, and benefit the country, such as a functioning rail network, should not be privately-owed.

That said, I remember British Rail, and they were hardly the halcyon days of luxury rail travel.

So the only people who'll use it are company people who are getting it paid for by clients. Rather than families, couples, you know, normal day to day people.

Not sure where I said that....

[Count Steer]

If they'd started at the top end it would have made more sense (and would probably have got finished). It seems to be all about London again and, as someone suggested recently, economically, the UK is a bit like New York with a chunk of Southern Italy bolted on. It's the norf that needs most investment/regeneration/jobs etc.

[Le_Fromage_Grande]

Get rid of it because I don't want anymore countryside under concrete

[Horse]

Why spunk many many billions of pounds on a public transport solution to shave off less than hour?

One of the main reasons for HS2 is to allow for much more (slower) freight and 'local' trains on the existing network.

[gremlin]

If they'd started at the top end it would have made more sense (and would probably have got finished). It seems to be all about London again and, as someone suggested recently, economically, the UK is a bit like New York with a chunk of Southern Italy bolted on. It's the norf that needs most investment/regeneration/jobs etc.

And this is my gripe with the whole 'levelling up' argument for HS2. Yes, people can get to the 'Northern Powerhouse' from London quicker, but then people from the north can get to London a lot quicker. Ergo, it opens up more opportunity to work in London, thus draining the northern workforce.

[Horse]

It's the norf that needs most investment/regeneration/jobs etc.

And they are going to be so grateful when they realise that 'levelling up' means prices will go up.

[Dodgy69]

Bin...maybe in a few years when everything else has been sorted.

[weeksy]

Not gonna disagree with that. I'm a capitalist at heart, but even I think some things that are in the national interest, and benefit the country, such as a functioning rail network, should not be privately-owed.

That said, I remember British Rail, and they were hardly the halcyon days of luxury rail travel.

So the only people who'll use it are company people who are getting it paid for by clients. Rather than families, couples, you know, normal day to day people.

Not sure where I said that....

I never said you did.... However, i said it...

[KungFooBob]

They should invest all those billions into personal teleporter development.

[Mussels]

Was HS1 a success?

[Mr. Dazzle]

Was HS1 a success?

If you're going to Paris it's bloody great IME!

Bit shit for getting to Birmingham, but honestly, which would you rather visit?

[gremlin]

So the only people who'll use it are company people who are getting it paid for by clients. Rather than families, couples, you know, normal day to day people.

Not sure where I said that....

I never said you did.... However, i said it...

This is all getting a bit ming-mong ping-pong

Whatever happened to that smiley?

[MrLongbeard]

Why spunk many many billions of pounds on a public transport solution to shave off less than hour?

One of the main reasons for HS2 is to allow for much more (slower) freight and 'local' trains on the existing network.

Reduce, reuse, recycle, no need to increase freight capacity in the middle of a climate crisis.