People dynamics

[weeksy]

Surprise you.... you're wrong...

What you think you've seen is very different to what i've seen...

[Horse]

Is it in our nature to bully as part of a pack? Why? It seems to happen in most animals that live in groups.

It's nothing new. Anyone who had Lord of the Flies as a set book at school would have read around the subject. Probably goes back to when humans were still pack animals rather than domesticated.

Sometimes it's conformance being enforced, such as military uniforms. Other times it's where people want to belong to a group or 'tribe'. They will adopt the clothing, haircut - and attitudes when looking 'out'.

A few minutes Google time should find you the psychology behind it.

Perhaps what you're asking, too, is where does bants become bullying?

http://revtothelimit.co.uk/viewtopic.php

[Screwdriver]

I think I missed all the action so I don't know exactly who was being "bullied", I assume however it was me. I do not have a victim mentality so I don't see the trolling of my posts that way. From my perspective there is one obvious nasty old man, clearly deeply unhappy, who takes out his inadequacies online. The other usual suspects are just mean. Which is fine so long as there is an element of fairness and understanding.

Fairness in that if it is always the same nasty old man constantly prodding my posts until I react, some consideration should be made as to who exactly is the guilty party. Understanding such that if there is a violent reaction to something I have said or a mindless insult due to an assumption regarding what I mean, then I should have the chance to talk it through.

For the last year or so neither has been the case. When the obvious player decides it is time to spoil the conversation, he wades in and I get the blame, my account is suspended, my posts or posts I engage with are locked or deleted. That is so mind bendingly unfair (from my perspective) it does annoy the hell out of me. I can see how an outside observer would consider that "bullying.

On the other hand, this forum has an owner and he can do whatever the fuck he wants and if being "unfair" is the easiest route for him, I must accept that. For what it's worth, what I need is a consistent set of rules so that I can avoid crossing the boundaries e.g."next time just tell him to "fuck off". Did that, I still got punished. Ok next time just report the post, did that, still got banned/deleted post (there were too many reports!).

I'm quite happy to carry on since there are a handful of very smart people here I have "known" for years now but it is becoming somewhat tedious when the same troll pulls the same trick with the same result.

I await any meaningful response before I share a less personal response regarding people dynamics and discuss why I think it is that social media is doomed to fail.

[MyLittleStudPony]

Some say "bullying", I say "management training".

I have been arming my kids with nasty nicknames and little bullying rhymes to use at school - they're the currency of the playground!

For example, ones I've come up with about specific children in my kids' classes:

"You can tell by the smell that his name is Miguel".

"His name is Cruise and he likes to do ................................................................ homework".

The inference of course in the latter being that he likes to do poos rather than homework. It's all in the timing.





As for those who like to make out they're big-time on the internet, well what does Mister Ice-T have to say about that?

ICET.jpg (64.67 KiB) Viewed 1076 times

[Horse]

I think I missed all the action so I don't know exactly who was being "bullied", I assume however it was me.

It wasn't.

[mangocrazy]

Why start a thread that is intentionally provocative and has the assumption that it will be shut down? Wouldn't it be better to start a thread that is non-confrontational?

[weeksy]

.Fairness in that if it is always the same nasty old man constantly prodding my posts until I react,

I'm not sure what 'rule' you actually want me to enforce sometimes.

Both you and Yorick took a 1 day ban for it... both the same punishment, both for being abusive.

Ant is currently on a 1 dayer for being a deliberate toll and provoking.... Maybe you see yours as that too, but personally i draw lines in my head and Ants crossed that, the comments made by Yorick usually are not over that line. They may not be what you want to read or see, but that doesn't mean they actually break any of the forum rules.
I can't start throwing bans about just because someone feels slightly hard done to.

You could argue that some of the "it'll be sold within a week" directed at Taipan are bullying using that logic, but it's not (unless he tells me differently).

You have a style of posting that's bordering on bewlidering for me. You came into the other Russell Brand thread and basically said "no, you're all wrong and i'm right", which is exactly what you usually do in different threads. You belittle peoples opinions and throw out your "no, this is correct".... but forgetting things like emotions, human elements or even just simple decorum. Until you actually see this, i'm not sure what i can do other than what i do.

Now i may well be wrong here in yours and Potters opinion, however, that's how it is... if i'm wrong, then so be it, i'm wrong. However, as the old saying goes, it's my ball and my playground. Whilst i made the forum for 'you' lot... i can only enforce things as i see fit...

There's a door, it swings both ways, i don't make anyone sign into this place who doesn't want to be here.

[Screwdriver]

I have been arming my kids with nasty nicknames and little bullying rhymes to use at school - they're the currency of the playground!

Are you sure that's a good idea? I often pop up to Yorkshire to see my ex and get to play with some five year olds. They really can rip the piss out of me (I love playing the fool!) and during some "banter" I let slip "silly-Billy" (the kids name was Billy). A look of horror flashed across at me from the ex and I realised just how damaging that might be if that moniker stuck...

[JackyJoll]

That’s a very mean thing to say to Potty-Boy, you big bully!

[JackyJoll]

I have been arming my kids with nasty nicknames and little bullying rhymes to use at school - they're the currency of the playground!

Are you sure that's a good idea? I often pop up to Yorkshire to see my ex and get to play with some five year olds. They really can rip the piss out of me (I love playing the fool!) and during some "banter" I let slip "silly-Billy" (the kids name was Billy). A look of horror flashed across at me from the ex and I realised just how damaging that might be if that moniker stuck...

He can’t have avoided the expression “silly Billy,” to age five!

[Screwdriver]

Why start a thread that is intentionally provocative and has the assumption that it will be shut down? Wouldn't it be better to start a thread that is non-confrontational?

They really are not meant to be. I was worried that the build up of Russian forces around Ukraine was a sign of impending invasion. That was months before they did. I recall all of the "battles" with the majority view that I was talking bollocks. Elon Musk was (and is) a world changing character, my post on him prior to the Twitter purchase got the same treatment.

It is with some satisfaction I note the "Biden mafia" is years later, finally being outed by the mainstream and we can put another "conspiracy theory" to bed.

If this was mumsnet then yes, we could discuss knitting. If I can get my act together, I can start posting picture heavy bike rebuilds (they are ALL still sitting in the shed where I left them). Meanwhile I have been battling with a serious illness and a recalcitrant NHS so my activities are somewhat limited. There is light at the end of that tunnel.

[Screwdriver]

He can’t have avoided the expression “silly Billy,” to age five!

IKR, I couldn't resist for five minutes. I just question if it is a wise decision for an adult to reinforce that sort of behaviour.

[Horse]

Why start a thread that is intentionally provocative and has the assumption that it will be shut down? Wouldn't it be better to start a thread that is non-confrontational?

They really are not meant to be.

Again, I don't think Mango was referring to you / your threads. eg, in the OP:

perhaps this thread will not to be here when I come back on

[Noggin]

There's a balance isn't there. Groups of people that know each other well often aim jokes, ribbing, etc at each other, that people 'outside' would not understand at all and would be horrified to hear/read.

I don't really see 'bullying' here, more frustration on both sides (usually) at lack of understanding of the 'other point of view' - so the explanations get more and more tense. And then get taken the 'wrong' way. Or explanations in minute details that are read as patronising (or something) and then offence is taken.

Is it a case of "when does taking the piss cross the line"? IMHO, this place has far far less than both the previous places we were all in, so there is less of whatever causes this 'look'. Maybe because of that, it seems worse?



Many years ago when I joined VD and the TRC I struggled with the humour/abuse/pisstaking. I hadn't had groups of friends like the groups on there. I didn't get the humour that was intended with the insults. A mate sat me down (well, sent me a pm!!) and told me to buck up and stop being 'scared' of the replies!! Then I made friends IRL with a similar humour and started to understand it more


You can post a view and not take offence when someone replies with a different view. You can restate your case. But you can't take the attitude (here or IRL) of -

"Let me explain again because you didn't understand. If you understood you would totally agree with me."


That isn't how life works. That's when the disputes start because that is just so very patronising and condescending (are they the same?).

We can have different opinions with the same information. Sometimes those change with more info, sometimes they don't. But don't take offence when other people (sometimes more than one person) doesn't agree. Thats a kind of "ok, well I still have the same opinion but I don't need to fight about it cos it's just my opinion", isn't it?

[DefTrap]

Whether you like it or not, if you share a similar opinion, that's you in a gang , especially on here where all nuance is missed and explanations endless. If you deliberately choose a counter opinion that's just being contrary.

Raising the bullying card is ridiculous.

[Screwdriver]

.Fairness in that if it is always the same nasty old man constantly prodding my posts until I react,

I'm not sure what 'rule' you actually want me to enforce sometimes.

Well YOUR rules. Just tell me what they are and don't move the goalposts. I will of course aim for just inside. I gave a couple of example above where you tell me one thing and when I comply, I still get kicked.

I find it difficult to dance around handbags trying not to cause "offence" when discussing deeply contentious subjects. I choose to engage because I often find myself seeing situation from a perspective that somehow others do not and I'd like to understand why that is. Sometimes of course I will present my understanding of a subject as "the truth" because it is true that this is my opinion on the matter.

I will then consider any evidence which refutes my understanding. This is how we learn. My opinions are not cast in steel, they can and often are moulded and shaped by interactions but that doesn't work if the only reaction is "conspiracy theorist nut job".

There was a ton of thought provoking content in that thread in a very difficult subject and to delete it just because of one moron can't be a good thing for any forum.

[weeksy]

Well YOUR rules. Just tell me what they are and don't move the goalposts.

You see the FAQs and 'Forum Rules' they're outlined in there

viewtopic.php?t=24

[Count Steer]

I think I missed all the action so I don't know exactly who was being "bullied", I assume however it was me.

It wasn't.

But it soon will be......

[weeksy]

I will of course aim for just inside.

There was a ton of thought provoking content in that thread in a very difficult subject and to delete it just because of one moron can't be a good thing for any forum.

1. Why ? why aim for anything that's just inside the rules ? Why not try to be nice, functioning, appropriate ? Do you not see THIS is exactly why we have issues... Jeeez.

2. You were the moron. Don't you see that you were the problem with your lack of compassion, understanding and complete inability to see anything other than 'Screwdriver is right'

There was a lot of thought provoking stuff, but that doesn't mean the thread should have stayed.

[JackyJoll]

He can’t have avoided the expression “silly Billy,” to age five!

IKR, I couldn't resist for five minutes. I just question if it is a wise decision for an adult to reinforce that sort of behaviour.

In general, you’re right it’s bad!