In todays news...

[Mr. Dazzle]

So, are you sure it was the EU that allowed low pay?

I don't know about that, but here is another angle.

My BIL reckoned his place (big supermarket chain warehouse/distribution) was a nightmare because it was mostly staffed by immigrants who will work like a dog, take all overtime available and live in shared accommodation. They were here to make the maximum money possible and would work their arses off for crazy hours to do it.

Fair play to them, but what it meant was the normal UK lads who didn't want the overtime because they had a life outside of work, and only wanted to work like a normal person for a normal wage, all got squeezed out. The management wanted these grafters who would take on extra hours at a moments notice and work like madmen without complaint.

He reckoned things got better after a lot of the immigrants started to thin out a bit.

So it wasn't just about the money.

TBF that sounds like an argument against a pure capitalist economy rather than Breggzit.

[Ant]

So, are you sure it was the EU that allowed low pay?

I don't know about that, but here is another angle.

My BIL reckoned his place (big supermarket chain warehouse/distribution) was a nightmare because it was mostly staffed by immigrants who will work like a dog, take all overtime available and live in shared accommodation. They were here to make the maximum money possible and would work their arses off for crazy hours to do it.

Fair play to them, but what it meant was the normal UK lads who didn't want the overtime because they had a life outside of work, and only wanted to work like a normal person for a normal wage, all got squeezed out. The management wanted these grafters who would take on extra hours at a moments notice and work like madmen without complaint.

He reckoned things got better after a lot of the immigrants started to thin out a bit.

So it wasn't just about the money.

TBF that sounds like an argument against a pure capitalist economy rather than Breggzit.

Absolutely spot on.

Another thing which didn't add up, were the anti-capitalists, anti-elite protestors, who are all waving their EU flags. You couldn't get any more elite and capitalist than the EU

[Noggin]

I don't know about that, but here is another angle.

My BIL reckoned his place (big supermarket chain warehouse/distribution) was a nightmare because it was mostly staffed by immigrants who will work like a dog, take all overtime available and live in shared accommodation. They were here to make the maximum money possible and would work their arses off for crazy hours to do it.

Fair play to them, but what it meant was the normal UK lads who didn't want the overtime because they had a life outside of work, and only wanted to work like a normal person for a normal wage, all got squeezed out. The management wanted these grafters who would take on extra hours at a moments notice and work like madmen without complaint.

He reckoned things got better after a lot of the immigrants started to thin out a bit.

So it wasn't just about the money.

TBF that sounds like an argument against a pure capitalist economy rather than Breggzit.

Absolutely spot on.

Another thing which didn't add up, were the anti-capitalists, anti-elite protestors, who are all waving their EU flags. You couldn't get any more elite and capitalist than the EU

I am pretty sure that most of the 'elite' WANTED Brexit due to new tax laws meaning they'd be taxed a ton more on their accounts in the EU (or off shore - not 100% clear on that). Of course, anything that shows that it was the elite that wanted out wouldn't get much press!! It did get some as I remember reading it. But not as much as it should have done

[Ant]

TBF that sounds like an argument against a pure capitalist economy rather than Breggzit.

Absolutely spot on.

Another thing which didn't add up, were the anti-capitalists, anti-elite protestors, who are all waving their EU flags. You couldn't get any more elite and capitalist than the EU

I am pretty sure that most of the 'elite' WANTED Brexit due to new tax laws meaning they'd be taxed a ton more on their accounts in the EU (or off shore - not 100% clear on that). Of course, anything that shows that it was the elite that wanted out wouldn't get much press!! It did get some as I remember reading it. But not as much as it should have done

The majority of the elites wanted to stay in the EU. Some of them even had top jobs in the EU, paid for by the members or course......

[Kneerly Down]

I am pretty sure that most of the 'elite' WANTED Brexit due to new tax laws meaning they'd be taxed a ton more on their accounts in the EU (or off shore - not 100% clear on that). Of course, anything that shows that it was the elite that wanted out wouldn't get much press!! It did get some as I remember reading it. But not as much as it should have done

You can be pretty sure of something and yet be completely wrong
Maybe it didn't get so much press because it was wrong?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/50168357

[Mr. Dazzle]

First seize the means of cheap online delivery.

[Noggin]

I am pretty sure that most of the 'elite' WANTED Brexit due to new tax laws meaning they'd be taxed a ton more on their accounts in the EU (or off shore - not 100% clear on that). Of course, anything that shows that it was the elite that wanted out wouldn't get much press!! It did get some as I remember reading it. But not as much as it should have done

You can be pretty sure of something and yet be completely wrong
Maybe it didn't get so much press because it was wrong?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/50168357

Fair point. TBF, I did stop reading any of the UK press after October 2017!! So might have missed this fact checker! But at least I know that it was something that was 'mooted' around the time of Brexit!

Equally, the article says that "But the rules are, in fact, all already part of UK law. A small number of them will not come into effect until 1 January, but that would have happened anyway whether or not the UK was a member of the EU." - But if I remember correctly, the UK has already changed quite a few laws (employment ones are some that I have read about) since Brexit, so there's nothing stopping people in charge changing laws to benefit themselves now


I never say anything as if I am 100% right. But some things I'm sure about and others only pretty sure - but I'd rarely say something is a fact on here cos far far more people actually read and inwardly digest papers/news/info and I try not to!

[mangocrazy]

One of the main drivers (if not the main driver) of a certain section of UK investors/hedge fund managers to exit the EU before June 2017 was the 4th EU Money Laundering Directive (MLD), subsequently followed by the 5th and 6th MLDs. These are some of the main targets of the 4th MLD:

1. Emphasis on ultimate beneficial ownership and enhanced customer due diligence
2. Expanded definition of a politically exposed person to domestic PEPs
3. Cash payment threshold lowered to €10,000 (US$11,250)
4. Expanded to include the entire gambling sector beyond just casinos
5. Enhanced risk-based approach, requiring evidence-based measures

Point 1 is almost certainly the point that had a lot of UK investors/fund managers running scared. One of the factors that makes the UK such an attractive place for shady individuals and businesses to operate in, is the opacity surrounding ultimate beneficial ownership, normally obscured by layers of shell companies and off-shore trusts.

The EU's intention to remove this smokescreen surrounding ultimate beneficial ownership clearly rattled a lot of cages, notably of people like Arron Banks and Jacob Rees-Mogg. So 'the Elite' did want the UK to exit the EU, but it wasn't exactly the elite that was portrayed in the populist media.

[Horse]

Meanwhile:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-66007675

A water company that has imposed a hosepipe ban has blamed people working from home for the shortage.

South East Water, which supplies more than two million homes and businesses in Sussex and Kent, will implement the restriction from Monday.

Chief Executive David Hinton said demand had swelled by about 20% over a short period of time which had put the existing infrastructure under stress.
...
In a letter to customers, Mr Hinton described people working from home as a "key factor" behind the ban.

He wrote: "Over the past three years the way in which drinking water is being used across the south east has changed considerably.

"The rise of working from home has increased drinking water demand in commuter towns by around 20% over a very short period, testing our existing infrastructure."


Are they truly saying that so many people who live in their areas used to work outside of it?

[Ant]

I think they've watered down the real reason.

[Horse]

I think they've watered down the real reason.

But is there a solution?

[Ant]

I think they've watered down the real reason.

But is there a solution?

Possibly, I'm just trying to tap into it.....

[Horse]

I think they've watered down the real reason.

But is there a solution?

Possibly, I'm just trying to tap into it.....

Take care it's not just pipe dreams instead of the mains event. We don't want your ideas going down the drain.

But if you do have ideas, will you post them all in one gushing fountain, or drip feed them to us? We are thirsty for your knowledge.


Let the ideas flow, don't tank them in a reservoir. Let them flow, don't faucet.

Post here using your preferred Internet bowser.

[Ant]

But is there a solution?

Possibly, I'm just trying to tap into it.....

Take care it's not just pipe dreams instead of the mains event. We don't want your ideas going down the drain.

But if you do have ideas, will you post them all in one gushing fountain, or drip feed them to us? We are thirsty for your knowledge.


Let the ideas flow, don't tank them in a reservoir. Let them flow, don't faucet.

Post here using your preferred Internet bowser.

You certainly have a shower of ideas....

[Kneerly Down]

One of the main drivers (if not the main driver) of a certain section of UK investors/hedge fund managers to exit the EU before June 2017 was the 4th EU Money Laundering Directive (MLD), subsequently followed by the 5th and 6th MLDs. These are some of the main targets of the 4th MLD:

1. Emphasis on ultimate beneficial ownership and enhanced customer due diligence
Point 1 is almost certainly the point that had a lot of UK investors/fund managers running scared.

The UK has brought in the 4th and 5th MLD. It is probably ahead of most EU countries in enforcing the requirements of the 6th MLD.
In what tangible ways is the UK behind the EU on ML and UBO?
I could raise it with our lawyers I'm meeting next week to go through compliance processes.

[MrLongbeard]

I do get it though, just get a bit peeved at constantly reading how the EU allows for unfair wages etc etc etc - it doesn't! It's regulated very strongly and whilst some companies may disregard the rules, certainly in France they will get caught out and penalised.

Minimum wages are set by (some) member states (Denmark, Italy, Austria, Finland and Sweden do not have one), The EU didn't propose a minimum wage across The EU until 2020 https://ec.europa.eu/social/main.jsp?ca ... &langId=en which was not published until the end of 2022 https://eur-lex.europa.eu/eli/dir/2022/ ... ?locale=en

And even then it does not set a minimum wage or require a statutory one in member states.

[Horse]

Possibly, I'm just trying to tap into it.....

Take care it's not just pipe dreams instead of the mains event. We don't want your ideas going down the drain.

But if you do have ideas, will you post them all in one gushing fountain, or drip feed them to us? We are thirsty for your knowledge.


Let the ideas flow, don't tank them in a reservoir. Let them flow, don't faucet.

Post here using your preferred Internet bowser.

You certainly have a shower of ideas....

An absolute flood, it seems.

[Ant]

Take care it's not just pipe dreams instead of the mains event. We don't want your ideas going down the drain.

But if you do have ideas, will you post them all in one gushing fountain, or drip feed them to us? We are thirsty for your knowledge.


Let the ideas flow, don't tank them in a reservoir. Let them flow, don't faucet.

Post here using your preferred Internet bowser.

You certainly have a shower of ideas....

An absolute flood, it seems.

At least they are reasonable and not ex-stream.

[Horse]

You certainly have a shower of ideas....

An absolute flood, it seems.

At least they are reasonable and not ex-stream.

Keep them coming, don't want your thoughts to run dry, or worse still, you to have a drought of ideas. In this weather, keep hydrated so you can sprinkle ideas on us.

[Ant]

An absolute flood, it seems.

At least they are reasonable and not ex-stream.

Keep them coming, don't want your thoughts to run dry, or worse still, you to have a drought of ideas. In this weather, keep hydrated so you can sprinkle ideas on us.

I will, there's a pool of them.