Would you have an electric car if you had the money for a new car and were in the market for one?

[Couchy]

Friend has the new Porsche Taycan with the sound generator, yup it makes an engine noise to the outside world lol. Nice car and quick but still does nothing for me. Fake engine note aside it's the same noise as a Nissan leaf. Lease plus electric still works out more expensive than running a diesel and you still have the EV downsides. We see a lot of care dealers whilst installing charge points and most are saying the market for selling to private buyers is dead. Lease companies and low BIK are all that's keeping the market going and as soon as the tax benefits change it'll kill that too. It's still rare to see an EV up here, maybe see 2 or 3 a week.

[Pirahna]

We see a lot of care dealers whilst installing charge points and most are saying the market for selling to private buyers is dead. Lease companies and low BIK are all that's keeping the market going and as soon as the tax benefits change it'll kill that too. It's still rare to see an EV up here, maybe see 2 or 3 a week.

That'll start to change, after 2030 if you want a new fossile fueled vehicle it'll be a lorry.

[Mr. Dazzle]

See them all the time here, it does seem to vary massively.

As it 'appens, when I was at the Distinguished Gentleman's Ride a few weeks back the subject of EVs was being discussed. I said "I bet there's more than one EV in the carpark here" in the context of a discussion about how rare they are....and I was right! There were 2 I walk past at least 4 (2 of which are parked on street, not plugged in) on the 1 mile trek to baby D's school.

[Mr. Dazzle]

Any car nerds remember the prototype/demonstrator/concept Mercedes C111? Mercedes do!

Yeah OK there's a lot of concept car nonsense here, but it does have some substance behind it. New battery tech and new motor tech, crucially from "real companies" rather than just vapour ware.

The silicon battery tech is particularly interesting. On paper, silicon can be used to increase battery power density by a factor of 10 (compared to the graphite used in nearly every Lithium battery today). Of course, that factor of 10 is just the "nominally possible", but the 40% improvement they talk about is a real value by the sounds of it.

https://www.topgear.com/car-news/electr ... eborn-c111

[Taipan]

Any car nerds remember the prototype/demonstrator/concept Mercedes C111? Mercedes do!

Yeah OK there's a lot of concept car nonsense here, but it does have some substance behind it. New battery tech and new motor tech, crucially from "real companies" rather than just vapour ware.

The silicon battery tech is particularly interesting. On paper, silicon can be used to increase battery power density by a factor of 10 (compared to the graphite used in nearly every Lithium battery today). Of course, that factor of 10 is just the "nominally possible", but the 40% improvement they talk about is a real value by the sounds of it.

https://www.topgear.com/car-news/electr ... eborn-c111

Its a Matra Bagheera!!

[Mr. Dazzle]

Its a Matra Bagheera!!

The original C111 (which is the one which looks like the Matra) did something daft like 250mph it the late 70s Mercedes just fucking around to see what's possible.

EDIT: Yeah, 250mph in 1979! Even more impressive is the run where they averaged nearly 15mpg....at 195mph!

[ZRX61]

Friend has the new Porsche Taycan with the sound generator, yup it makes an engine noise to the outside world lol. Nice car and quick but still does nothing for me. Fake engine note aside it's the same noise as a Nissan leaf. Lease plus electric still works out more expensive than running a diesel and you still have the EV downsides. We see a lot of care dealers whilst installing charge points and most are saying the market for selling to private buyers is dead. Lease companies and low BIK are all that's keeping the market going and as soon as the tax benefits change it'll kill that too. It's still rare to see an EV up here, maybe see 2 or 3 a week.

On Fords it's called FENG: Fake Engine Noise Generator. Mustangs have it, as do Explorer ST's. I can't speak to Mustangs, but on the ST it's to disguise the injector rattle. The volume of it depends on if it's in normal, sport or eco mode. I find it annoying, but I guess it's preferable to listening to the injectors rattle like loose tappets. ST is still in the shop for a new trans etc for at least another week, the loaner VW Atlas is very quiet inside without VW-FENG... but the VW would struggle to pull the skin off rice pudding. It's a gutless fucking slug, the ST has spoiled me.

[Mr. Dazzle]

S'a legal requirement (on the outside) in leccy cars now, so you can hear 'em coming. Cuts out (or at least, isn't legally required any more) at something like 15kph because at that speed the tyres are noisier anyway.

I'm a bit fuzzy on when and how it's introduced. AFAIK it's anything post 2019 in Europe, but think that's only cars which were homologated post 2019, 'cause brand new Teslas don't make the noise. Brand new Mercs, Porches and Audis etc. do though.

[Slenver]

brand new Teslas don't make the noise.

They do, or at least some do. I had this same discussion with a friend just the other day as his new Model Y does it, but his previous 3 didn't. We were trying to work out when it became mandatory.

Edit: Just checked gov site and they have this to say:

From 1 July 2019, all manufacturers must install a system in new types of quiet electric and hybrid electric vehicles. Sound generators will produce a specified level of noise when they are reversing or running below 20 km/h (about 12mph). The sound generated will be similar to that made by a conventional engine and can be temporarily deactivated by the driver if judged necessary.

Model Y started builds in Jan 2020, so that all stacks up. Though clearly the 'sound generated will be similar to that made by a conventional engine' is flexible as the Y sounds like a spaceship. Also it can't be deactivated, at least as far as my mate can find, but it could be buried deep in some menu

[Cousin Jack]

That'll start to change, after 2030 if you want a new fossile fueled vehicle it'll be a lorry.

Or a new 'people's champion' will challenge for government, and will win by a landslide.

[Cousin Jack]

My hybrid Lexus will make vroom vroom noises if I ask it to. Only inside, using the radio.

[Mr. Dazzle]

Model Y started builds in Jan 2020, so that all stacks up. Though clearly the 'sound generated will be similar to that made by a conventional engine' is flexible as the Y sounds like a spaceship. Also it can't be deactivated, at least as far as my mate can find, but it could be buried deep in some menu

Not heard the Tesla version, but I think it's quite clever how the noise is "modulated". It rises in pitch and intensity as the cars speeds up, there's a difference between "gunning it" and just "creeping" even at the same speed. Couldnt' tell you what that difference actually is, but you instinctively know what it means. Must have been an interesting exercise for the people who created it.

[Slenver]

Not heard the Tesla version, but I think it's quite clever how the noise is "modulated". It rises in pitch and intensity as the cars speeds up, there's a difference between "gunning it" and just "creeping" even at the same speed. Couldnt' tell you what that difference actually is, but you instinctively know what it means. Must have been an interesting exercise for the people who created it.

Didn't notice that as the times I heard it he was just manoeuvring/parking etc.

It's a really eerie, sci-fi noise though. Very 'woo-oooo!', if you can picture that.

[Mr. Dazzle]

Said it before and I'll say it again.

It should sound like a Tie Fighter.

[Horse]

It's a really eerie, sci-fi noise though. Very 'woo-oooo!'

Neighbours have a Renault Zoe.

As they slow, approaching their house, it sounds like dying harmonium

[Noggin]

A mate in the uk has just bought a Porsche Taycan 4S

I’m kinda gutted I live too far away to have a go!!! Apparently it can be charged by solar panels on it too, so based on the sunshine stats around here I’ve suggested he visits

[Slenver]

Apparently it can be charged by solar panels on it too

Think he may be pulling your leg...

[Noggin]

Apparently it can be charged by solar panels on it too

Think he may be pulling your leg...

Good chance you're right - or that I misread his comment!! LOL

And free power whilst it’s sunny as I’ll take it straight from the solar panels

He probably has solar panels on the house!

[Mr. Dazzle]

Solar power on ya house combined with an EV is an attractive move.

Solar power without a battery is basically bullshit now, the 'feed in' tariff you get is pants (in the UK at least), it hasn't gone up in line with the 'buy' prices so now there's a huuuuuuuuuge disconnect between the two.

I didn't realise you could now do Vehicle 2 Grid in the UK (i.e. run your house off your car batt). I knew the cars could do it, but I was under the impression infrastructure didn't support it yet...but not so. There are a couple of hoops to jump through AIUI, but it's possible from a technical PoV now. My colleague's just started doing it, he's got 8kW of panels on the roof and he stores excess juice in his car's battery, then runs power off the car at night. Means he didn't have to pay another few thousand for a domestic battery.

[Slenver]

My colleague's just started doing it, he's got 8kW of panels on the roof and he stores excess juice in his car's battery, then runs power off the car at night. Means he didn't have to pay another few thousand for a domestic battery.

it's true and potentially quite cool. Though obviously if you're using it all on the house overnight then you can't use your car! So you save 'a few thousand' on a domestic battery by simply spending 50k on a car one instead