If we were to rejoin the EU tomorrow, what benefits would you miss most about Brexit?

[mangocrazy]

Winter in the south of France might be a bit cooler than you imagine, there's a reason the French winter in Spain if they can.

Snow is very rare in our little corner of France, and causes comical disruption when even a tiny amount falls. But night time temperatures around zero are quite common in Jan/Feb. The difference is that day time temps will mainly be in double figures. This is the week ahead's forecast for Pezenas, about 7-8kms away from us.

Pezenas_Feb_2023.JPG (54.06 KiB) Viewed 383 times

[Hoonercat]

I was under the impression that prior to Brexit folks in Spain could apply for long term residency ? Was that the case ?
I realise a lot of the Costa Blanca posse kind of didn't bother - and yes the 90 days thing is an issue - so why not apply for long term residency?

You can't just apply for residency then sod off back to the UK for a few years until you're ready to retire I belive you need to spend at least 6 months per year in the country for your residency permit to continue.

Once the bitchy "getting even" about Brexit dies down, I am sure in the usual Spanish way, a blind eye will be turned to the 90 days. Southern Europe needs money and investment...

Yeah there's plenty of would-be expats who made that same 'they need us more than we need them' mistake. And it's not just about individual countries - every entrance and exit of the Schengen zone gets registered. If you overstay by a few days you'll probably just get a small fine when you leave the zone, if you take the piss you'll be looking at a much larger fine, possible deportation and being banned from re-entering for a certain time period. Not worth the risk if you own a property, plus having a permament address means it's not exactly hard to track you down.

There's a couple who bought a house a few villages from me who came over with that same attitude. Sold their UK business and house, bought a brand new £50k+ VW tourer, bought a village house here in Bulgaria, threw their 2 dogs in the motor and left the UK for good. But immigration officials really don't care how minted you are, or how much beer and fags you can get through to support their economy. Unfortunately for them, unless you have a permanent income (even a UK state pension will suffice) you now won't get residency here, no matter how much you have in savings (though I believe France will accept proof of savings in some circumstances, if you don't have the required income level). Last year this couple and their dogs spent 3 months in BG, 3 months in Turkey, another 3 in BG then 3 months in the UK. They said they intend to go to Spain for 3 months this year instead of the UK, but once Bulgaria joins the Schengen zone they won't be able to do that either.

[mangocrazy]

You obviously know more about this than I... Not aware of it - the nearest naturist bit that I'm aware of is Cap d'Agde, which is about 30 kms from Pezenas and on the Med. That does have a certain reputation... The inhabitants of our little village (about 35-40 kms away from Cap d'Agde) are more likely to be either tending the vines or down the bar.

[mangocrazy]

Yeah, Agde and Cap d'Agde are a bit like that. I've only spent a a few hours in Agde in the 20 years that I've owned the house.

[irie]

But it was still a moan about have two houses and the difficult choices that creates.

No. It was noting that he is unable to spend time how he had intended, through no fault of his own.

... folks in Spain could apply for long term residency ? ... the Costa Blanca posse... the usual Spanish way

I was under the impression that his place is in France. M, care to clarify?

My bad !
Perhaps he can clarify the French situation ( because I quite fancy buying a property in the SoF to get away from the UK winter)?

Buying a house in France is one thing, but selling is another.

You should make yourself aware of what the costs are and what taxes are payable if/when you come to sell that house.

[Horse]

You should make yourself aware of what the costs are and what taxes are payable if/when you come to sell that house.

[mangocrazy]

It's worth stating that if you are thinking about French property as a means to make money, you'd be well advised to look elsewhere. French property prices (for the most part) are nothing like as prone to irrational surges as they are in the UK. I've owned my property for 20 years, done a fair amount of improvements to it and it would probably only have gained 25-35% in value in that time. There are also CGT and social charge levies payable if and when you sell. You buy French property because you want a property in France, not as a get rich quick scheme.

[Felix]

I popped into a supermarket again yesterday to get some lunch bits in, plenty of fruit and veg again. Bought another 6 tomatos which I don't need. But anyway, as a brexit special, today I'm going to make bacon, lettuce and tomato baguettes

Dont put them in the fridge whatever you do . Apparently if you do you are a tosser.

[DefTrap]

Yeah you don't buy french houses as investments. And yeah the notaires and estate agents, and additional taxes, are fecking eye watering.

As for elderly expats living on a shoestring, don't hang out with them so yeah maybe if you say so. More or less miserable than the UK? Probably louder at shouting about it in terrible anecdotes.

I went to agde once, what you might expect for a cheaper part of the French med coast. Yes a surprising number of proper nudist hangouts - we accidentally wandered through a 'resort' while out on a walk. Didn't hang around because the kids were appalled.

[Horse]

Thanks to Brexit we've now overtaken France as the biggest whine producers in Europe.

STFU the lots of youse.

The irony being that if Sunak's NI deal gets anywhere near going through, it'll be diehard leavers doing the moaning

[cheb]

I didn't specify which side were whining. From my seat on the fence it sounds like both. But then with my hearing being so bad it might just be a whole of blokes talking bolotics and desperately trying to be right.

[Mr Moofo]

As you say, his money, and he can spend it on what he wants. But it was still a moan about have two houses and the difficult choices that creates.

You're doing an Ant here, and seeing only what you want to see. My comment was on a thread about the supposed 'benefits' of Brexit, one of which I pointed out. It was not a 'moan about having two houses and the difficult choices that creates', it was a comment on one of the consequences of Brexit. I have not and will never moan about the 'difficulties' of having two houses - I'm aware that I'm in what might seem to be a privileged position, but it's all down to choices. I don't lead an expensive lifestyle, I don't drive flashy cars etc., instead I prefer to spend my money on a) motorbikes and b) a modest property in the south of France. Your choices are doubtless different.

And it is your money, you have worked for it and you should spend it how you want to. You seem to be more than happy with your choices and you have made them. What I think is irrelevant.
Greenman , however, was going on about how shit the UK is - without ever having lived outside of Bristol . Now I quite liked my time in Bristol - but everywhere has its shitholes. But perhaps he needs to make some choices like you have - and see if the grass in greener.

[Noggin]

As you say, his money, and he can spend it on what he wants. But it was still a moan about have two houses and the difficult choices that creates.

You're doing an Ant here, and seeing only what you want to see. My comment was on a thread about the supposed 'benefits' of Brexit, one of which I pointed out. It was not a 'moan about having two houses and the difficult choices that creates', it was a comment on one of the consequences of Brexit. I have not and will never moan about the 'difficulties' of having two houses - I'm aware that I'm in what might seem to be a privileged position, but it's all down to choices. I don't lead an expensive lifestyle, I don't drive flashy cars etc., instead I prefer to spend my money on a) motorbikes and b) a modest property in the south of France. Your choices are doubtless different.

And it is your money, you have worked for it and you should spend it how you want to. You seem to be more than happy with your choices and you have made them. What I think is irrelevant.
Greenman , however, was going on about how shit the UK is - without ever having lived outside of Bristol . Now I quite liked my time in Bristol - but everywhere has its shitholes. But perhaps he needs to make some choices like you have - and see if the grass in greener.

I used to like Bristol. The bit I stayed in wasn't the nicest and was near some less nice areas, but overall the people were great.

Brexit started and I wouldn't live there again if you paid me to.

The politics, vitriol, racism and other views that were hurled around put me off ever wanting to live there again. Sadly, that also coloured y view on most of the uk as I doubt it was just that small area that thought that way!

I do know that not everyone is like that, but to see a whole group of people change from nice folks that I chatted with every day to vitriol spouting racists was scary and seriously unpleasant, but also very sad.

[Treadeager]

I do know that not everyone is like that, but to see a whole group of people change from nice folks that I chatted with every day to vitriol spouting racists was scary and seriously unpleasant, but also very sad.

There can't be any two places on earth , closer to a multi-cultural , egalitarian Nirvana than the ski slopes of Europe or Dubai ?

It's by design, make people conform to a political identity to remove individualism.

Read Brave New World, the government controllers go to extremes to remove individualism and manage social order. What we have in the UK is not quite the same but the control concept of removing individualism is somewhat similar, polarise people into two main camps and they can be controlled via their party. Once they've mentally signed up to it they'll rarely stray, even if their party juggles principles and swaps politics, it's members will sway with it, they have two choices, truth or satisfaction and the man in the street will always choose satisfaction.
Satisfaction is having someone to blame and someone to resent - that's a lot more palatable than the truth.

My point is that people are very rarely acting on their own individual well-considered principles, they're simply reaching for an off-the-shelf solution like (for example) racist ideology because it gives them a bogeyman, or Marxist ideology because it gives them the fantasy of a solution.

You can see the impacts of the erosion of individualism on here, there are only a few individuals and the rest fight in packs, loyal to a party even if it juxtaposes fundamental principles. Two legs bad, four legs good.

[Treadeager]

I do know that not everyone is like that, but to see a whole group of people change from nice folks that I chatted with every day to vitriol spouting racists was scary and seriously unpleasant, but also very sad.

It's by design, make people conform to a political identity to remove individualism.

Read Brave New World, the government controllers go to extremes to remove individualism and manage social order. What we have in the UK is not quite the same but the control concept of removing individualism is somewhat similar, polarise people into two main camps and they can be controlled via their party. Once they've mentally signed up to it they'll rarely stray, even if their party juggles principles and swaps politics, it's members will sway with it, they have two choices, truth or satisfaction and the man in the street will always choose satisfaction.
Satisfaction is having someone to blame and someone to resent - that's a lot more palatable than the truth.

My point is that people are very rarely acting on their own individual well-considered principles, they're simply reaching for an off-the-shelf solution like (for example) racist ideology because it gives them a bogeyman, or Marxist ideology because it gives them the fantasy of a solution.

You can see the impacts of the erosion of individualism on here, there are only a few individuals and the rest fight in packs, loyal to a party even if it juxtaposes fundamental principles. Two legs bad, four legs good.

There can't be any two places on Earth , closer to a multi-cultural , egalitarian Nirvana , than the ski slopes of Europe or Dubai ?

[Noggin]

I do know that not everyone is like that, but to see a whole group of people change from nice folks that I chatted with every day to vitriol spouting racists was scary and seriously unpleasant, but also very sad.

It's by design, make people conform to a political identity to remove individualism.

Read Brave New World, the government controllers go to extremes to remove individualism and manage social order. What we have in the UK is not quite the same but the control concept of removing individualism is somewhat similar, polarise people into two main camps and they can be controlled via their party. Once they've mentally signed up to it they'll rarely stray, even if their party juggles principles and swaps politics, it's members will sway with it, they have two choices, truth or satisfaction and the man in the street will always choose satisfaction.
Satisfaction is having someone to blame and someone to resent - that's a lot more palatable than the truth.

My point is that people are very rarely acting on their own individual well-considered principles, they're simply reaching for an off-the-shelf solution like (for example) racist ideology because it gives them a bogeyman, or Marxist ideology because it gives them the fantasy of a solution.

You can see the impacts of the erosion of individualism on here, there are only a few individuals and the rest fight in packs, loyal to a party even if it juxtaposes fundamental principles. Two legs bad, four legs good.

I honestly think I saw both. Some very intelligent people with very deep seated 'isms' - some of which were exacerbated by the media/government controllers.

The flip side was some well meaning and easily led people who read the papers/social media and spouted what it said.

It still made me very sad Getting shouted at by a friend I'd known for 20 years because he thought I was 'stupid' to vote stay when he also knew I lived (at the time) half the year in another country and back in the uk for the other half. That was disappointing

I do know that not everyone is like that, but to see a whole group of people change from nice folks that I chatted with every day to vitriol spouting racists was scary and seriously unpleasant, but also very sad.

It's by design, make people conform to a political identity to remove individualism.

Read Brave New World, the government controllers go to extremes to remove individualism and manage social order. What we have in the UK is not quite the same but the control concept of removing individualism is somewhat similar, polarise people into two main camps and they can be controlled via their party. Once they've mentally signed up to it they'll rarely stray, even if their party juggles principles and swaps politics, it's members will sway with it, they have two choices, truth or satisfaction and the man in the street will always choose satisfaction.
Satisfaction is having someone to blame and someone to resent - that's a lot more palatable than the truth.

My point is that people are very rarely acting on their own individual well-considered principles, they're simply reaching for an off-the-shelf solution like (for example) racist ideology because it gives them a bogeyman, or Marxist ideology because it gives them the fantasy of a solution.

You can see the impacts of the erosion of individualism on here, there are only a few individuals and the rest fight in packs, loyal to a party even if it juxtaposes fundamental principles. Two legs bad, four legs good.

There can't be any two places on earth , closer to a multi-cultural , egalitarian Nirvana than the ski slopes of Europe or Dubai ?

I'm not particularly clever with words, so not really sure what you mean? Sorry, little words please as even with a dictionary, I can't work that out??

[Treadeager]

I believe I'm asking you if you really believe that where you live now is actually less racist than Brizzle ?

[mangocrazy]

It still made me very sad Getting shouted at by a friend I'd known for 20 years because he thought I was 'stupid' to vote stay when he also knew I lived (at the time) half the year in another country and back in the uk for the other half. That was disappointing

That is completely indefensible, but simply shows that people often are incapable of realising how the other person's situation will make them react very differently than themselves to a particular question. It speaks of a lack of empathy. Or selfishness, I suppose. One thing that the whole Brexit debate does seem to have done is make a lot of people a lot more narrow-minded. And that applies to the both sides of the argument I would stress.

[Mussels]

I'm not sure racism has a clear meaning anymore. It used to be racist to treat darker skinned people differently, when colour-blindness was mostly achieved it became about not treating them differently. It was convenient to group all darker skins together against whitey until it showed whitey was being disadvantaged, then it focussed on various smaller groups to produce the right figures for different stats.
It is just a word militants like to shout for whatever their cause is and they change the meaning to suit each time.
It's obvious when hard of thinking militants try to import every American social problem over here, they don't care if it's relevant.

[G.P]

I don't think Bristol is really any different than it was a decade / twenty years ago. The fuckwit Mayor(s) had a bigger impact no detracting from the quality of life in the city than Brexit / wokeness and the tearing down of Colston's statue.
I can't get used to the Colston hall being called the Bristol Beacon, but I'll cope.
I was at Temple meads station at 10.00 last night. There was a perfectly pleasant multi cultural atmosphere. Even the Welsh Ex Pats who'd been back to Cardiff to see their team loose to the mighty England were in good spirits