Depression

[Docca]

This might be helpful

https://www.simplypsychology.org/locus-of-control.html

[Greenman]

I think more should be invested in living with who you are than who you want to be when dealing with the latter.

I'd tend to agree, you have to love yourself, but one could interpret this as almost giving up, i.e. learn to live with it, rather than try to change it.
Another view is to decide who you want to be and then try to become that person.

I've always found DiClemente & Prochaska's Stages of Change, or Transtheoretical Model of Behaviour Change, a decent philosophy, I think it was drawn up to help with stopping smoking, but you can apply it to anything.

Fundamentally it's Pavlovian, if you practice doing something or being the person you want to be for long enough then you'll eventually become that person.
I read somewhere that if you force yourself to laugh several times a day, every day, even when you don't want to, then after some time your brain chemistry actually changes and you produce more happy chemicals.

I also fall back on the theory of control, feeling in control is a massive pathway to feeling happier.

Stop copying and pasting and trying to pass it off as your own thoughts...

It's spot on though.

We are creatures of culture and we pick up on things very quickly even without knowing it. A bit like accents, we stay in a forgien country for a prolonged period of time and our accent we have known for decades without knowing changes.

IMO and as Docca says you need to work best with what you have, not try and become someone that has something you don't, that is only as path to destruction and self loathing! What you have from birth is everything you need to be amazing, you just have to work out how to use it to the best of it's abilities!

[MyLittleStudPony]

Matter is energy. In the universe, there are many energy fields which we cannot normally perceive. Some energies have a spiritual source which act upon a person's soul. However, this soul does not exist ab initio, as orthodox Christianity teaches. It has to be brought into existence by a process of guided self-observation. However, this is rarely achieved, owing to man's unique ability to be distracted from spiritual matters by everyday trivia

[tricol]

I would agree with all of that. But, for over 20 years I don't know why I'm unhappy/depressed/anxious. I can look at decisions I've made that fueled it, but it wasn't the root cause. Something went wrong somewhere and it hasn't been put right. Countless CBT sessions, talking therapies and medication has done sweet f**k all.

[Docca]

Then I’d offer caution over investing anymore of your time left on this planet trying to find an answer.

It is entirely possible to ‘change career’ path with your outlook.


I’ll caveat all of my contribution to this thread with my view is probably dated now. I’ve not kept up with current thinking because I know longer treat people and am not a practicing clinician.

There was a beautiful paraphrased statement once given to me by a patient, with a take on ‘the harder I worked, the luckier i got’.

‘I’m the only cunt living my life’. Quite poetic.

[darthpunk]

I would agree with all of that. But, for over 20 years I don't know why I'm unhappy/depressed/anxious. I can look at decisions I've made that fueled it, but it wasn't the root cause. Something went wrong somewhere and it hasn't been put right. Countless CBT sessions, talking therapies and medication has done sweet f**k all.

That's my particular issue as well, it's like being depressed for depressed sake, almost like becoming so used to the feeling that you know no other way of being

I've done talking therapy/CBT/Autism tests and it's the same thing every time......low self esteem/worth but no real solid way to deal with it. I went exercise daft, ate better, cut out drink, all that happened was I had better fitting jeans while still being inherently miserable

Only think i've not tried is a bike. Got a holiday booked in July, and then after that i'll find out if there's anything in the whole Mental Health Motorbike thing. I did my CBT and theory and to be honest, when doing the CBT I just didn't have time to be depressed, I was too busy concentrating and smiling like an idiot when a guy on a big scooter gave me "The Nod"

Only thing that currently worries me is that obsessive behaviours have taken a proper nosedive, which although seems like a good thing, I don't obsess over bikes anywhere near as much and I start wonder if I'm just going to waste my money

I'm rambling now

[Cousin Jack]

I've never really been proper depressed. I have had periods of depression, but I mostly climbed out of them in days or weeks rather than months. So anything I say may not be relevant, but I'll offer it anyway. It might help.

Often my brief periods of depression have been triggered by 'stuff' that I had no control over. My response (and it worked for me) was to sit and make a plan in my head for the worst possible outcome. If the shit hit the fan in a really big way I had a plan, it was probably a completely useless and inadequate plan, but it was never tested because my worst-case scenarios were way OTT anyway, and didn't happen. The knowledge that I had a plan in my head was enough to help me out of the depression, and I could then make realistic plans to deal with the minor shit that did come my way.

Bikes (and other things) are useful to get away from worrying about stuff. Riding a bike is good, but you can't ride a bike and worry about work/wives/kids/life. If you do something bad will happen, mostly it will scare the shit out of you and remind you to concentrate on the ride, alternatively (and fortunately only occasionally) it will kill you and you will have no more worries. Many sports are similar if less dramatic, you have to concentrate on that moment or the game/sport will go to ratshit.

[Noggin]

The psychologist in the first physical rehab place over here asked me if I meditate, to which I replied "god no, I can't get 'into' it, my brain just keeps wandering"

After a couple of chats, she said "you do know that the two things that make you the calmest and happiest are essentially meditative?"

These were riding the bike and ski touring (the walking up bit).

After some discussion, I realised she's right. Meditation is about clearing the mind (apparently) which I can't do in a yoga class or sitting looking at the view. But walking up a mountain on skis (and to a degree, skiing back down) and riding a motorbike, I don't have anything else in my head. Just the total concentration on the activity in hand.

I spose the reason for sharing this is that, whilst it may not be a solution to depression, having a sport or activity that you can 100% focus on can actually help the brain some. I know that when I started biking and then again when I started skiing, I really noticed how much calmer I was afterwards and yes, happier. Not always happy, but less sad at the least!


Not sure how much this will help anyone, but I guess if someone else gets a benefit from it, then that's cool

[Cousin Jack]

.............. having a sport or activity that you can 100% focus on can actually help the brain some.

I used to shoot pistol, and I found that massively useful in that you cannot shoot accurately without thinking 100% about the sight picture and the trigger pressure. If you don't clear your head of everything else your scores will be pants. The last shot doesn't matter, the next one doesn't matter, every bit of your focus is on THIS one.

I am sure lots of other sports and hobbies are similar.

[Yorick]

.............. having a sport or activity that you can 100% focus on can actually help the brain some.

I used to shoot pistol, and I found that massively useful in that you cannot shoot accurately without thinking 100% about the sight picture and the trigger pressure. If you don't clear your head of everything else your scores will be pants. The last shot doesn't matter, the next one doesn't matter, every bit of your focus is on THIS one.

I am sure lots of other sports and hobbies are similar.

When I was racing, or even just bonkers play laps when instructing, it was all so cool and relaxing.
When it was right, you were just gliding from apex to apex.
Hard to explain but it was beautiful and peaceful.

My work funded anxiety doctor told me to go instructing when I was first signed off sick.

[darthpunk]

I used to shoot pistol, and I found that massively useful in that you cannot shoot accurately without thinking 100% about the sight picture and the trigger pressure. If you don't clear your head of everything else your scores will be pants. The last shot doesn't matter, the next one doesn't matter, every bit of your focus is on THIS one.

So did I, back in the 90's and up to the ban on full bore/semi auto etc I did Practical Pistol......this for anyone curious

https://youtu.be/sh3w-fhjipw

I got pretty obsessed with mountain biking for a while, then music and then depression and all interest in anything just fell away after that. Now I'm constantly looking for something to do with my time outside work and family.

It was my mate who said that I've never been the same since I stopped shooting. Fairly sure it's probably just a coincidence, but it was the one interest that I had that I was completely invested in.

[Noggin]

I used to shoot pistol, and I found that massively useful in that you cannot shoot accurately without thinking 100% about the sight picture and the trigger pressure. If you don't clear your head of everything else your scores will be pants. The last shot doesn't matter, the next one doesn't matter, every bit of your focus is on THIS one.

So did I, back in the 90's and up to the ban on full bore/semi auto etc I did Practical Pistol......this for anyone curious

https://youtu.be/sh3w-fhjipw

I got pretty obsessed with mountain biking for a while, then music and then depression and all interest in anything just fell away after that. Now I'm constantly looking for something to do with my time outside work and family.

It was my mate who said that I've never been the same since I stopped shooting. Fairly sure it's probably just a coincidence, but it was the one interest that I had that I was completely invested in.

Is there any chance you can go again? I know that the last few years have been more difficult because I couldn't ride bikes and couldn't ski much and when I did I was always wary. Makes so much difference to be able to do something you are passionate about (or completely invested in) even if you don't do it every day. Might be worth trying?

[darthpunk]

Is there any chance you can go again? I know that the last few years have been more difficult because I couldn't ride bikes and couldn't ski much and when I did I was always wary. Makes so much difference to be able to do something you are passionate about (or completely invested in) even if you don't do it every day. Might be worth trying?

I looked in to it, but to be honest after the furore the last time with the ban and losing a crap load of money and time I invested in it, I just don't have the heart to get involved again. Also, I took a lot of shit for having partaken in the sport after Dunblane. Plus, the hoops you have to jump through now, and as ridiculous as it sounds, the restrictions on calibre and the pathetic attempts to get round restrictions with long barrelled pistols and AR-15 style 22 rifles just seems a bit much. It's like the government telling all bikers they could only ride 250 Honda Superdreams with a sidecar. I think the ship has sailed and I just need to fire myself back up again with something that I do actually feel passionate about.

I say that bikes don't get me fired up like I seem to think anymore, but every time I get that smell that only a bike engine seems to have, or the sound when one flies past It takes me right back to being a kid on the back of my dad's or uncles bikes

It does seem weirdly pathetic that the whole thing that gets me down most is not having a hobby to be passionate about

[Count Steer]

Might be of interest. Radio 4 Inside Health seem to have been running a few things on depression. The latest was about the use of psychedelics. There was a lot of work done in the 50s but it all got canned when stuff like LSD and pscylocybin got popular for other reasons. Now they're investigating again. Seems quite promising in some cases.

[Bowman]

Is there any chance you can go again? I know that the last few years have been more difficult because I couldn't ride bikes and couldn't ski much and when I did I was always wary. Makes so much difference to be able to do something you are passionate about (or completely invested in) even if you don't do it every day. Might be worth trying?

I looked in to it, but to be honest after the furore the last time with the ban and losing a crap load of money and time I invested in it, I just don't have the heart to get involved again. Also, I took a lot of shit for having partaken in the sport after Dunblane. Plus, the hoops you have to jump through now, and as ridiculous as it sounds, the restrictions on calibre and the pathetic attempts to get round restrictions with long barrelled pistols and AR-15 style 22 rifles just seems a bit much. It's like the government telling all bikers they could only ride 250 Honda Superdreams with a sidecar. I think the ship has sailed and I just need to fire myself back up again with something that I do actually feel passionate about.

I say that bikes don't get me fired up like I seem to think anymore, but every time I get that smell that only a bike engine seems to have, or the sound when one flies past It takes me right back to being a kid on the back of my dad's or uncles bikes

It does seem weirdly pathetic that the whole thing that gets me down most is not having a hobby to be passionate about

It could be worth having a look at practical shotgun. It's a good community and you still sort of get the big gun feel.
It works for me.
Oh and trackdays, lots and lots of trackdays.
With the right people there's nothing that refreshes me more.

[Noggin]

It does seem weirdly pathetic that the whole thing that gets me down most is not having a hobby to be passionate about

Not at all.

I could have totally given up many many times in the last few years as each summer that should have been a biking summer wasn't. And with various doctors/surgeons/physios doing the sucky-teeth thing about motorbike riding, it's always been a difficult balance to keep going until I was sure. Now I'm sure I can ride, I just can't ride the bike I have everyday - which is still a bit of a downer!

A hobby you are passionate about is all encompassing. And not in a bad way (normally), if you can get on and do other things!! LOL But having it there to do is such a huge thing mentally that when it's gone its really really tough.


I don't know enough about guns to comment really, but maybe Bowman's suggestion could be worth a try.

But - definitely track days are worth a try, and then keep doing them to make sure!! LOL

[Cousin Jack]

I looked in to it, but to be honest after the furore the last time with the ban and losing a crap load of money and time I invested in it, I just don't have the heart to get involved again. Also, I took a lot of shit for having partaken in the sport after Dunblane. Plus, the hoops you have to jump through now, and as ridiculous as it sounds, the restrictions on calibre and the pathetic attempts to get round restrictions with long barrelled pistols and AR-15 style 22 rifles just seems a bit much. It's like the government telling all bikers they could only ride 250 Honda Superdreams with a sidecar. I think the ship has sailed and I just need to fire myself back up again with something that I do actually feel passionate about.

I totally agree that the law on guns is ludicrous, but best get used to the fact that the ship has not just sailed, but sunk too. After the last round of lunacy in Plymouth (again, not the law being wrong, but the police not enforcing it properly), shotguns will be the next to suffer.

Target rifle does nothing for me, they are waaay too serious. Airgun shooting is technically difficult, but deeply unsatisfying. I almost got hooked on fencing, but left it too late in life, and getting serious about that was a heart attack waiting to happen. Bikes are the answer, you have loads of choices, off road, cruising down to the cafe, trackdays, racing , touring or just bimbling around the local backroads.

[wull]

Is there any chance you can go again? I know that the last few years have been more difficult because I couldn't ride bikes and couldn't ski much and when I did I was always wary. Makes so much difference to be able to do something you are passionate about (or completely invested in) even if you don't do it every day. Might be worth trying?

I looked in to it, but to be honest after the furore the last time with the ban and losing a crap load of money and time I invested in it, I just don't have the heart to get involved again. Also, I took a lot of shit for having partaken in the sport after Dunblane. Plus, the hoops you have to jump through now, and as ridiculous as it sounds, the restrictions on calibre and the pathetic attempts to get round restrictions with long barrelled pistols and AR-15 style 22 rifles just seems a bit much. It's like the government telling all bikers they could only ride 250 Honda Superdreams with a sidecar. I think the ship has sailed and I just need to fire myself back up again with something that I do actually feel passionate about.

I say that bikes don't get me fired up like I seem to think anymore, but every time I get that smell that only a bike engine seems to have, or the sound when one flies past It takes me right back to being a kid on the back of my dad's or uncles bikes

It does seem weirdly pathetic that the whole thing that gets me down most is not having a hobby to be passionate about

Dunblane is a day I remember so well, our school was immediately locked down and we were kept there for hours. He used to shoot at the local rifle club and Dunblane was so close.

[darthpunk]

Had a chat with the missus yesterday, she thinks my depression isn't what it was and I'm probably in more of a midlife crisis than anything. The Lightweight Adventurers Podcast covered this and the symptoms they mentioned marry up quite nicely.

• Don't know who they are anymore

• Stuck in a rut

• Begin to regret the path they didn't take

• Feel that time is runnin out

• Suffer mood swings

• Feel apathetic, "Down in the dumps" or actively depressed

• Think about death or dying more

They say that they read that in the Haynes manual for the Midlife Crisis someone bought one of them as a joke. And they take ti with a pinch of salt however the points they make are that something generally treated as a bit of a joke in men (screw the secretary, buy the Porsche) is really rooted in truth.

Not to say I didn't have, maybe still have, depression. Very long store extremely short, Mother was an arse, bit of a narcissist, caused holy hell in life and marriage between me and the missus. We've moved on from her drama and my wife flung her out of the house one day when she was being an arse and she's not been a problem much since.

Hangover from all that is I became a hermit, lost joy in life, work etc to the point where confidence hit an all time low. Add in previous money worries that are long behind me and I don't do anything or am willing to spend money without fretting about it.

Anyway, off on a ramble again, as usual my other half talks the most amount of sense in the house again so I'll try and get back to moaning about the state of custom bikes and drooling over second hand 70's hondas and Gibson guitars again. I need to stop over analysing the past so much and look for new things rather than going over and over past glory's

[Cousin Jack]

Don't know who they are anymore
Stuck in a rut
Begin to regret the path they didn't take
Feel that time is runnin out
Suffer mood swings
Feel apathetic, "Down in the dumps" or actively depressed
Think about death or dying more

Bloody hell - that list covers most of us over about 50!

Don't beat yourself up about it, we all think about "the path we didn't take". However be aware you can only see the start of that path, if you had taken it it might have ended somewhere dark and nasty, far worse that the here and now.

Time IS running out! So enjoy the time you have left, you can do bog-all about the past.

Think about death or dying? Yep, when I was a teenager I was immortal, in my 70s death is getting uncomfortably close, so best stop worrying and enjoy the life that is left