Worn clutch - notchy gearbox?

[A_morti]

Evening gents.

My G650GS's gearbox is notchy to the point it doesn't want to shift, but only sometimes. Seems to be worst after the oil has got circulating, but before it's really hot, although IDK if that's a rule or even relevant. If anything, it feels like I've not quite pulled the clutch all the way in, but I definitely have.

I know the clutch is worn a bit thin. It's not slipping, but I've had to put the adjuster fork on the bottom to its last spline.
Couple of videos here on the FB regarding the clutch:

In the replies, one guy put a picture measuring his brand new clutch cable, and mine is the same length, moves freely and is adjusted well, so I'm not suspecting the cable.

My question: could worn thin clutch plates cause that clunkiness, or do I have multiple faults to track down?

[Le_Fromage_Grande]

Sounds like the clutch is dragging, too most obvious causes are too much free play on the cable or swollen friction plates caused by them absorbing too much oil, EBC plates are bad for this.

There are other causes, mostly worn clutch release mechanisms, but some bikes have weird clutch adjustment routines, old Kawasakis have to be done in the right order or the clutch will either slip or drag depending on how you get it wrong (I've done both)

[A_morti]

There is a specific routine for this bike. They want the length of exposed cable at the engine end to be xx-yy millimetres. I completely ignored that spec, since the adjustment was dictated by the worn plates.

Fuggit, oil change first since IDK what's in there, check sprocket bearings (I've had them leave the chat before "leaving the chat" was a thing and istr it also messed with the shifting in weird ways) and rubbers, then clutch plates if that doesn't fix it.

[mangocrazy]

Has the clutch basket been ragged over time with chattering clutch plates? Seem to remember that being a dry clutch problem - not sure if it applies to wet clutches.

[Le_Fromage_Grande]

So you've "completely ignored" the recommended way to adjust the clutch and now you've got a poor gear change, do you think the two things might be related?

[A_morti]

I have no idea how important that is on this model bike.

To get the cable slack to a usable amount while having more than two threads engaged at the lever housing, the fork at the bottom must be engaged on its last spline before it hits the frame. Once I figured that out, it's irrelevant what spline the spec said the fork ought to be on.

[A_morti]

[Le_Fromage_Grande]

It's not sounding good to me, sounds like the cable is stretched.

What made you decide to venture into the world of random clutch adjustment?

[A_morti]

There's a thread in the projects section about this pooch of a bike. It came to me with 50k km and a whole raft of issues. One of them was a wildly out of adjustment clutch with centimetres of free play at the lever, which I assumed at a glance was because the PO had small hands and was using that to adjust the reach. No, I now think he just was ignoring it/too incompetent to adjust it himself. Probably the latter since he was also riding it with the top and bottom of the frame bolted together finger tight and 10psi in the tyres.

Anyway, as above, comments on that video from FB tell me the cable is fine, it's the plates which are worn. They aren't slipping yet but seems like they must be right at the end of their life, and maybe that extreme adjustment is what's causing it to drag. Or maybe as @mangocrazy says the basket is abused and notched. I've seen that before and it caused a juddery clutch which this bike doesn't have, but it's still possible given that the sticky shifting is inconsistent.

[Le_Fromage_Grande]

Could be the clutch centre nut coming undone, I've had a couple of old bikes do that, but I've never known worn plates to cause clutch drag, if it were mine I'd pull the clutch apart for a look inside, on most bikes it only takes an hour or two.

Having to move the arm on the splines means there's something pretty serious wrong if the cable is fine.

[Taipan]

There is a specific routine for this bike. They want the length of exposed cable at the engine end to be xx-yy millimetres. I completely ignored that spec, since the adjustment was dictated by the worn plates.

Fuggit, oil change first since IDK what's in there, check sprocket bearings (I've had them leave the chat before "leaving the chat" was a thing and istr it also messed with the shifting in weird ways) and rubbers, then clutch plates if that doesn't fix it.

The adjustment must be done from the gearbox first and handlebar lever second. A lot of bikes are really fussy about this. IIRC one of my SV650s had a similar bad clutch action until I adjusted it properly.

[A_morti]

Could be the clutch centre nut coming undone, I've had a couple of old bikes do that, but I've never known worn plates to cause clutch drag, if it were mine I'd pull the clutch apart for a look inside, on most bikes it only takes an hour or two.

Having to move the arm on the splines means there's something pretty serious wrong if the cable is fine.

It's a huge ordeal to change the clutch on the previous f650gs, you have to drain the oil and water and strip half the bike down to release the engine side cover, because they ran an external hard oil line in front of the cover which has to come off. But on the g650gs, there's a really easy sub-cover to remove, just a few bolts and you're in. I think it's even sealed with a (usually) reusable o-ring. It'll be a next weekend job to open it and inspect, I'll do an oil change at same time.

This bike doesn't have a threaded bottom cable adjuster like every other bike I've had or seen, instead you get additional adjustment by moving the fork on its splines.

[Demannu]

The majority of les locals who ask me for help are usually spotty oiks who have just fitted a new clutch or cable and have no idea what they're doing.
Nearly always fully out at the handlebar (freeplay adjustment) and not enough at the pivot (actuator adjustment).
You may also have a locknut adjuster on the clutch centre, but that requires removal of clutch cover.
Guessing the wafting isnt going too well!

[A_morti]

Just realised I've been having a brain fart. The cable is stretched, isn't it? Has to be since I'm taking up slack at the bottom.

Wafting... Not so great tbh. The brakes on this one are better than I remember on the old 2004 F650 I had back around 2014, but the suspension is harsher. They changed the shock from Showa to Sachs (or the other way around, I forget), and I had fitted progressive springs in the old one.

[Le_Fromage_Grande]

Just realised I've been having a brain fart. The cable is stretched, isn't it? Has to be since I'm taking up slack at the bottom.

I think so, whatever is wrong with it you have more movement than you should, most likely is the cable is about to die, but could be a worn mechanism (unlikely) or the clutch centre nut has come undone (possible)