Energy bills

[Ant]

I'm looking to better, more experienced people than me, to tell me how the boiler goes bangy bang bang from someone doing something watery.

This couldn't have been made easier for you if you knew how.

Imagine that I'm not being an argumentative bugger and that I have a genuine inquisitive interest, if you will, chaps.

My point is that because you haven't actually been trained to work on it, and you aren't qualified, then you might make a mistake whilst in there that could cause a failure resulting in injury or death. No one sets out to kill people when they work on a boiler, but sometimes they do because they don't spot their mistakes - and often those people are actually qualified - so you've got even more chance of messing up.

You might not, but then again you just might, and incompetence adds to the mix.

I actually tried to get the proper GasSafe ticket because I was BOAS accredited, but no one would sign me off to do it because they said I didn't have enough experience on that type of equipment and it's not something they give out lightly.

I have worked on my own boilers when I couldn't get anyone at short notice and we lost hot water and heating, but I do know it's naughty, I did take very great care and I'd always prefer to get someone in with the proper ticket if I can. Arrogance with these things kills people.

I know, we both made points.

I do like a technical conversation like this though. But to be fair, I did ask questions and didn't really get an answer other than 'we don't wany anyone else touching it'. You know, which is fine and dandy.

[Kneerly Down]

People shouldn't be allowed to buy portable heaters, especially ones that use propane that 'settles' when it leaks.

Of course, people shouldn't change their own tyres, do their own brakes or any number of things that could be hazardous.

The gas boiler that was put in by GasSafe installers for the previous owners of our house down south (as part of a government funded new boiler scheme) was definitely by cowboys. In fact they got the 'trinity' by messing up the electrics, gas and water. As an amateur I couldn't possibly hope to compete with that.

[Count Steer]

Waste of time. This is the internets, everybody knows that quoting qualifications and expertise counts for nowt.
I tried that on another thread, expertise is seen as not letting the inexperienced 'have a go at the answer', and I'm pretty sure I'm on ignore now.

On the internet, you can have any qualification you wish.

But if you really have them, and feel the need, you can post evidence. So, my leetle churm, do you believe I was not a CEng, MIGasE? Or equally, do you think Bowman is running his business without qualification? I mean, do feel free to call either or both of us liars....

I can also post up pics of my screwdriver collection.

[Ant]

But if you really have them, and feel the need, you can post evidence.

I could, yes.

So, my leetle churm, do you believe I was not a CEng, MIGasE? Or equally, do you think Bowman is running his business without qualification? I mean, do feel free to call either or both of us liars....

I can also post up pics of my screwdriver collection.

If you do that, I'll post up a picture of my socket sets, so you'd better be ready!

[DefTrap]

On the internet, you can have any qualification you wish.

Obvs. But if you chat shit, prepare to be taken down a peg. Having an opinion just won't cut it.

[Ant]

People shouldn't be allowed to buy portable heaters, especially ones that use propane that 'settles' when it leaks.

Of course, people shouldn't change their own tyres, do their own brakes or any number of things that could be hazardous.

The gas boiler that was put in by GasSafe installers for the previous owners of our house down south (as part of a government funded new boiler scheme) was definitely by cowboys. In fact they got the 'trinity' by messing up the electrics, gas and water. As an amateur I couldn't possibly hope to compete with that.

That's a good point, how far are we going with this? Mechanics getting up in arms about people changing their own oil and brakes?

Plus your GasSafe 'engineer' experience, the last one I met didn't give me much confidence.

[Ant]

On the internet, you can have any qualification you wish.

Obvs. But if you chat shit, prepare to be taken down a peg. Having an opinion just won't cut it.

As can be seen by the string of unanswered questions.

[Ant]

As can be seen by the string of unanswered questions.

I used to think that Chartered people must be dead clever and know everything, but imagine my surprise when I found out that they actually don't know exactly how and when an incompetent bloke will have an accident if he goes poking around in equipment that he isn't equipped to work on.

I can say it's possible, or even likely, but I don't know exactly how, when or by what mechanism it will occur.
But they put laws in to stop them doing it, so hopefully we don't have to.

Well, chartered engineers don't know everything. We have them at work, but gas boilers aren't their thing. But I'm sure if they suggested something may happen if, then when asked, they'd give a good breakdown.

You make assumptions by using the term incompetent, without knowing the skills etc of said person, which kind of throws it around that under the definition of competent person, someone like myself would be fine.

[Horse]

Like the family that got carbon monoxided because some utter plum thought 'how hard can it be to install a gas, flame-effect fire?' To be fair, the pipework was fine. They installed it, in the fireplace, but the chimney had been capped, at floor level, in the flat above. They never even used a smoke match to check the flue worked.

Another reason for tenants to be grateful that appliances are checked etc.

First house I bought had previously been owned by highly experienced DIYer. Experienced as in did a lot of it.

One of his epic achievements was fitting a gas fire in a fireplace.

The fireplace aperture was filled with a stainless steel sheet that had two circular holes for the flues.

So far, ok.

He'd supported the plate in place with a horizontal piece of wood. Unfortunately, He'd not actually fixed the wood, it was wedged there. And what happens when wood gets warmed up and dries? Yup, it shrinks. And falls across the two holes in the plate.

Only found when we had it replaced.


Other joys of his work included the clock socket wired to wall lights; part of the house round pin, part square - albeit incorrectly wired; bare wires hanging out of the walls; a flexible gas hose through a bulkhead; 15A socket taken off 5A lighting ...

Gotta love enthusiasts

[Ant]

If you miss screws in a boiler cover then you’d struggle to call yourself technically competent anywhere I’ve worked.

And who would miss them?

TBH, when you started to suggest something would happen to increase the pressure and burst fittings, that's when I, well, let's just say it's a bit of fun from then on.

[Bowman]

Like the family that got carbon monoxided because some utter plum thought 'how hard can it be to install a gas, flame-effect fire?' To be fair, the pipework was fine. They installed it, in the fireplace, but the chimney had been capped, at floor level, in the flat above. They never even used a smoke match to check the flue worked.

Another reason for tenants to be grateful that appliances are checked etc.

First house I bought had previously been owned by highly experienced DIYer. Experienced as in did a lot of it.

One of his epic achievements was fitting a gas fire in a fireplace.

The fireplace aperture was filled with a stainless steel sheet that had two circular holes for the flues.

So far, ok.

He'd supported the plate in place with a horizontal piece of wood. Unfortunately, He'd not actually fixed the wood, it was wedged there. And what happens when wood gets warmed up and dries? Yup, it shrinks. And falls across the two holes in the plate.

Only found when we had it replaced.


Other joys of his work included the clock socket wired to wall lights; part of the house round pin, part square - albeit incorrectly wired; bare wires hanging out of the walls; a flexible gas hose through a bulkhead; 15A socket taken off 5A lighting ...

Gotta love enthusiasts

I know it's problematic to post personal information on the Internet but I think we could get away with this one.
Was his first name Ant?

Edited. No names, no pack drill. CS.

[Horse]

Don't know.

I had the place rewired when I moved in. Three days, or so. On the second day, the electrician asked me whether I'd ever met the guy?

[Ant]

If you miss screws in a boiler cover then you’d struggle to call yourself technically competent anywhere I’ve worked.

And who would miss them?

TBH, when you started to suggest something would happen to increase the pressure and burst fittings, that's when I, well, let's just say it's a bit of fun from then on.

You’ve never had a heat exchanger blocked that caused a delta P issue and leaks? Never had a pressure relief valve fail? Happens frequently in larger applications.

I don’t know what you do for a job but I don’t think it’s building engineering.

It is unlikely to all happen at the same time, but then we go back to, what pressure can it get to? Are you aware of the pressure pipes and fittings can withstand?

[Bowman]

Don't know.

I had the place rewired when I moved in. Three days, or so. On the second day, the electrician asked me whether I'd ever met the guy?

Ah, it was just a (poor) attempt at dry humor referencing our resident boiler expert. Just thought he may have branched out into electric installs as well.

[Count Steer]

Don't know.

I had the place rewired when I moved in. Three days, or so. On the second day, the electrician asked me whether I'd ever met the guy?

Ah, it was just a (poor) attempt at dry humor referencing our resident boiler expert. Just thought he may have branched out into electric installs as well.

'Dry' humour....I see what you did there.

[Hoonercat]

You don't have the qualifications to work on gas boilers and wire houses.

The boiler will blow up, kill you, your family, and a dog that has wandered into your garden by mistake.

I shall prevent that explosion by not touching the gas.

I'll ask again, how will a boiler explode from touching only water? Do you have any examples?

Are you suggesting that all boilers are so poorly designed, that they will just explode? In that case, any boiler will do that from not even being touched.

You'll make a mistake because you don't have the proper skills or qualifications.
It will take 12 days, four minutes and nine seconds to blow up because of the mistake.

Tell me how will you prevent it?

So more than enough time for the dog to find its way out of the garden...?

[MrLongbeard]

Last time I dicked with a boiler I cheated and went in through the inspection window to remove the pilot jet, mostly because the dick who did the kitchen built the cupboard a smidge too small so I couldn't take the outer cover off.

[Ant]

It is unlikely to all happen at the same time, but then we go back to, what pressure can it get to? Are you aware of the pressure pipes and fittings can withstand?

We get riser pipe work that fails frequently just from gravity or lift pump pressure. NRVs that pop on a daily basis through fatigue.
Pipes and valves fail constantly when you look after tens of thousands of them and you don’t need mental pressures.

Edited to add - Small pressure changes of just a few percent can cause issues. That’s why you have devices like pressure vessels. The system doesn’t just rely on the capacity and integrity of the pipe work to contain a pressure increase, mainly because the chance of failure is increased.

Yes, pressure/expansion vessels is how we got onto this earlier on.

[Mr. Dazzle]

Last time I dicked with a boiler I cheated and went in through the inspection window to remove the pilot jet, mostly because the dick who did the kitchen built the cupboard a smidge too small so I couldn't take the outer cover off.

He was just thinking of your safety.

[MrLongbeard]

Last time I dicked with a boiler I cheated and went in through the inspection window to remove the pilot jet, mostly because the dick who did the kitchen built the cupboard a smidge too small so I couldn't take the outer cover off.

He was just thinking of your safety.

He underestimated my determination then, and forced me to make a new gasket for it the bastard