Qatar World Cup

[Felix]

It wont be a fucking football thread then.

[dern]

Are we gonna moan about the Qatar MotoGP as well?

I don't know if you're going to or not but the place fucking sucks and I don't think any sport should be going there until they get their act together.

I'm genuinely interest in why you say that, I have no skin in the game and nothing to defend, I just don't know why you hate Qatar?

The authorities there have a terrible reputation for upholding human rights. I know very few places are whiter that white but Qatar is really bad. Their attitude to migrant workers is genuinely shocking, freedom of expression is simply not there, they're intolerant of homosexuality to the point of making it a crime and women's rights are appalling and the guardianship system is about as backward as it gets.

[dern]

More info... https://www.amnesty.org/en/location/mid ... ort-qatar/

[dern]

The authorities there have a terrible reputation for upholding human rights. I know very few places are whiter that white but Qatar is really bad. Their attitude to migrant workers is genuinely shocking, freedom of expression is simply not there, they're intolerant of homosexuality to the point of making it a crime and women's rights are appalling and the guardianship system is about as backward as it gets.

I worked with migrant workers (I was one) and never saw any abuse or even unfairness.
Freedom of speech as you know it doesn't exist, I agree, I didn't mind, I had no desire to protest about anything so it never affected me.
I'm not gay but knew lads that were and they have their own gay clubs, it's technically illegal but well tolerated.
No idea about guardianship.

As I said, nothing to defend, I went there, worked there and left, I didn't see any of the big issues you say are there and thought I'd add my experience.

Some laws are quite unusual if you're used to a western system, like if you borrow money and don't pay it back then you can go to jail. If you walk out of your company without agreement then they can abscond you, because they're responsible for you, so if you commit crimes they're liable, so they abscond you, then if you get picked up by the police they'll deport you - you can't be there without a valid work permit.
You can resign and get a ticket home, no issues, I did it, but you can't just walk out of work without saying anything and go awol in the country doing whatever you want on someone else's visa.

It all seemed pretty fair to me.

I take your point and I haven't been there so can't counter anything you say with any personal experiences. The only thing I would say is that I do trust amnesty international so do trust their report. There's enough in there that I disagree with that I wouldn't want any of my cash to go to them by going to a game or paying to watch it here. I wouldn't work there based on what I understand to be the situation even if I wouldn't see any of it when I was there. That isn't a dig, just explaining my stance.

[DefTrap]

They weren't 'killed', they died, people die in the countries where they live, about 700,000 a year in the UK isn't it?

I came straight from the other thread where it was racist and into this one and perhaps misjudged it, perhaps this isn't a rpacist thread, so I've deleted my comments.

Fair dos.

I take your point about died as opposed to killed of course but it'd be nice to know the facts instead of 'quote spurious figure' v blanket pantomimey 'oh no it isn't!' replies.

I'm genuinely interested. I'm not super convinced it's a racist 'look at those nasty brown qataris up to no good' issue, but it certainly conveniently muddies the waters and prevents any rational analysis. If it genuinely boils down to certain parts of the globe not liking rich Arabs hogging all the oil I'm happy with that, it's a better answer than planned negligence of the rights of these migrant workers.

[Asian Boss]

The state of human rights in Qatar is a concern for several non-governmental organisations, such as Human Rights Watch, which reported in 2012 that hundreds of thousands of mostly South Asian migrant workers in construction in Qatar risk serious exploitation and abuse, sometimes amounting to forced labour. Awareness grew internationally after Qatar's selection to stage the 2022 World Cup, and some reforms have since taken place, including two sweeping changes in 2020.

Domestic servants, who are often poor women from South-east Asian countries, have few rights, and can become victims of human trafficking, sometimes forced into prostitution. There are restrictions on individual rights such as freedom of expression, and sodomy laws exist to punish homosexual men. Qatar's legal system is a mixture of civil law and Islamic law. Flogging is enforced as a punishment, and capital punishment, although rare in recent times, was enforced in 2020 for the first time in 17 years.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_rights_in_Qatar

I've been to Qatar. I wouldn't go back.

[Greenman]

The authorities there have a terrible reputation for upholding human rights. I know very few places are whiter that white but Qatar is really bad. Their attitude to migrant workers is genuinely shocking, freedom of expression is simply not there, they're intolerant of homosexuality to the point of making it a crime and women's rights are appalling and the guardianship system is about as backward as it gets.

I worked with migrant workers (I was one) and never saw any abuse or even unfairness.

Did you work with them and tell them what to do from your office in the city?

[Mr Moofo]

*cough*
It was in Russia 4 years before

Not known for its human rights , gay rights, freedom of speech or friendly culture - and dreadful racism / hooligans / Neo-nazis
To get into Russia you have to be prepared to give them your social media passwords etc

Obviously FIFA are trying to make a cluster fuck of everything.
But how big were the complaints 4 year ago?

That said, holding a World Cup means both the WC and the seasons become pointless. It will be full of excuses as why things happens or didn’t -

[wheelnut]

Apparently the England team have arrived in Qatar aboard Virgin Atlantic’s Rainbow Pride liveried plane.

[gremlin]

I can see the viewpoint of both camps here:

"I like footy and that's what im going for'. Fine with that.

And

'I take an ethical stand in line with by beliefs and I'm boycotting the whole thing'. Fair play.

People like Gary Neville, however, comes across as a massive hypocrite. Socialist and an outspoken critic of Tories ('cancer on the UK'). Yet he seems happy to pocket cash from a country that exploits workers, denies women basic rights and has outlawed homosexuality.

Be interesting to see how advertisers respond to the growing unease.

[Yambo]

Well, I've bought a ticket in the local sweepstake but with my luck I'll probably draw Qatar.

[gremlin]

Well, that'll make for a more sober atmosphere...

World Cup 2022: Alcohol sales banned at World Cup stadiums in Qatar

https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/63674631

The whole thing seems to be sliding into a farce.....

[weeksy]

What are they thinking?

It's almost like footie fans have got a reputation for getting pissed up and causing trouble and they're doing their best to prevent it

I don't think World Cups generally bring the same issues as leagues do though. Apart from the odd brawl....

But you can buy if it you're rich/important enough still apparently.

[Mr. Dazzle]

What are they thinking?

It's almost like footie fans have got a reputation for getting pissed up and causing trouble and they're doing their best to prevent it

My LOLage reached a peak with this bit:

"Those in corporate areas of stadiums at the tournament will still be able to purchase alcohol".

The world cup isn't just an excuse for corporate reacharounds, no sir

[Cousin Jack]

I have no interest in football, so no interest in going to see it. However I woouln't go to Qatar, or any of the other Middle East states with feudal governments and legal systems based on Islamic law that smacks of the Middle Ages.

[DefTrap]

More and more I think the politics of it is ridiculous.

Put the WC in a desert in the MiddleEast so that it makes it even more of a corporate circus than it already is, and makes it unavailable to JoePublic unless he's prepared to spend the price of numerous decent family holidays on it.
Then treat him like shit because he's obviously a hooligan and can't have a pint because it'll lead to a 10 day bender.
And then when you return home you have to suffer criticism of supposedly 'supporting an inhumane regime'.

I'm getting pissed and fighty from the comfort of my siting room.

[JackyJoll]

At least Scotland can bask smugly in its inability to qualify.

[Taipan]

Well, that'll make for a more sober atmosphere...

World Cup 2022: Alcohol sales banned at World Cup stadiums in Qatar

https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/63674631

The whole thing seems to be sliding into a farce.....

It was only going to end up like this. Culture clash to say the least. I did laugh at Budwiesers tweet though!

[gremlin]

More and more I think the politics of it is ridiculous.

Put the WC in a desert in the MiddleEast so that it makes it even more of a corporate circus than it already is, and makes it unavailable to JoePublic unless he's prepared to spend the price of numerous decent family holidays on it.
Then treat him like shit because he's obviously a hooligan and can't have a pint because it'll lead to a 10 day bender.
And then when you return home you have to suffer criticism of supposedly 'supporting an inhumane regime'.

I'm getting pissed and fighty from the comfort of my siting room.

My mate is out there. Much piss taking opportunity awaits.

[mangocrazy]

The beer ban is a definite line in the (desert) sand. Normally FIFA run the show, but the Qataris are saying 'our country, our rules'.