Yorick wrote: ↑Fri Nov 11, 2022 1:34 pm
We're all baffled why solar panels are frowned upon here. It's only recently that the "solar panel tax" was dropped.
I had friends who were doing investments in solar in Spain and France.
IIRC Spain went ahead with retrospective changes to the subsidies paid to solar power generators whereas France didn't, but did reduce the amount of energy that would be available to inject from solar into the grid, which was the basis of the payments.
It certainly made developers much more wary of placing their investments there.
In southern Spain there's huge fields with solar panels for miles and miles.
But no home solar users.
Yorick wrote: ↑Fri Nov 11, 2022 1:58 pm
In southern Spain there's huge fields with solar panels for miles and miles.
But no home solar users.
It was only very recently that a lot of capacity has been added...
In 2019 the UK generated a bigger % of its energy from solar PV than Spain!
Screenshot 2022-11-11 142118.jpg
Pretty shocking how long Spain wasn't adding any real additional solar capacity.
I saw them 6 or 7 years ago when I was driving down.
Maybe they've added even more since.
We're all baffled why solar panels are frowned upon here. It's only recently that the "solar panel tax" was dropped.
I feel the same about here and solar panels/wind. More wind for us I reckon but I'd take more wind farms for greener/cheap leccy it's a no bloody brainer.
We're all baffled why solar panels are frowned upon here. It's only recently that the "solar panel tax" was dropped.
I feel the same about here and solar panels/wind. More wind for us I reckon but I'd take more wind farms for greener/cheap leccy it's a no bloody brainer.
Wind makes a lot of sense here but lots of people don't want them where they can see them. I think they look quite elegant. Spain has an oversupply of quite uneconomically produced juice that they need to sell so they don't want people producing their own (yet). They could export it but France aren't v interested. Ends up with Spain putting in big solar in places, using it to make 'green' hydrogen and piping that to France (if the sub-sea pipeline gets built). It's all a bit bizarre.
Doubt is not a pleasant condition.
But certainty is an absurd one.
Voltaire
Mr. Dazzle wrote: ↑Fri Nov 11, 2022 4:25 pm
'Lots of people', but surveys repeatedly show the great majority of people support wind farms in the (very windy) UK.
People are dumb. They don't want artifical wind farms spoiling the view of the artifical farms dotted with artifical cottages
Are they the same ones that think the Lake District is a 'natural' landscape?
Doubt is not a pleasant condition.
But certainty is an absurd one.
Voltaire
Mr. Dazzle wrote: ↑Fri Nov 11, 2022 4:25 pm
'Lots of people', but surveys repeatedly show the great majority of people support wind farms in the (very windy) UK.
Onshore wind is very, very unreliable though, so we'd end up with an even bigger headache trying to match supply and demand than we will already face.
For much of today we've had c.15GW of wind power production and 5GW of gas.
If we add much more than another c.1/3 current UK wind power we'll end up having to pay for the wind farms to keep the brakes on.
As it is we're looking at say 3x the current UK wind power generation. I'd rather that was coming from c.50% utilisation offshore than 18-25% onshore wind so we can better plan how to manage the network.
Deep water offshore seems part of the long term solution here, wind is more reliable the further out you go. It would keep a load of roughnecks in jobs too.
Mr. Dazzle wrote: ↑Fri Nov 11, 2022 7:28 pm
We need more electric cars on charge!
So long as they don't want to go anywhere when we have high pressure loitering over the country!
Mr. Dazzle wrote: ↑Fri Nov 11, 2022 7:28 pm
Deep water offshore seems part of the long term solution here, wind is more reliable the further out you go. It would keep a load of roughnecks in jobs too.
Mr. Dazzle wrote: ↑Fri Nov 11, 2022 4:25 pm
'Lots of people', but surveys repeatedly show the great majority of people support wind farms in the (very windy) UK.
Horse wrote: ↑Fri Nov 11, 2022 7:53 pm
If only the UK had a coast, with tides ...
Tidal power is being provided c.4 times the price per unit of energy that onshore wind takes, and around double that of offshore wind.
The problem, therefore, is not that we can't access tidal power but that it is rather expensive!
Horse wrote: ↑Fri Nov 11, 2022 7:53 pm
If only the UK had a coast, with tides ...
Tidal power is being provided c.4 times the price per unit of energy that onshore wind takes, and around double that of offshore wind.
The problem, therefore, is not that we can't access tidal power but that it is rather expensive!
If it's dark, so no solar, and the wind's dropped, what's the price comparison then?
Horse wrote: ↑Fri Nov 11, 2022 10:16 pm
Ok , compare it to nuclear?
As said, about double the cost, and that's for the cherry-picked places to locate it.
I'm not saying that tidal has no place in the generation mix. It might even be 5 miles from me - the seabed was licensed for an array but has since been handed back to Crown Estate Scotland.
Horse wrote: ↑Fri Nov 11, 2022 9:08 pmIf it's dark, so no solar, and the wind's dropped, what's the price comparison then?
The price of solar when it's dark is 0p/kWh
What's the price of tidal at slack water?
Ok , compare it to nuclear?
Is there ever a time when the uk never has ebb or flow somewhere? Some places are lucky enough to have four high tides every day!
I know of Southampton, where else? And good luck installing something that might interfere with shipping and yachting near a huge container port and the home of UK yachting.
Horse wrote: ↑Fri Nov 11, 2022 10:16 pm
Ok , compare it to nuclear?
As said, about double the cost, and that's for the cherry-picked places to locate it.
I know that most tidal projects have been a bit Heath Robinson, environmentally iffy or promising at small scale but I'm surprised at that. Does the nuclear cost include decommissioning and storage?
Doubt is not a pleasant condition.
But certainty is an absurd one.
Voltaire
I think they look quite elegant. Spain has an oversupply of quite uneconomically produced juice that they need to sell so they don't want people producing their own (yet). They could export it but France aren't v interested. Ends up with Spain putting in big solar in places, using it to make 'green' hydrogen and piping that to France (if the sub-sea pipeline gets built). It's all a bit bizarre.
