New Bike

[weeksy]

Sometimes people need a bit of practise before they start going fast.

Only if they know - and understand- what they should be doing. Not everyone will be able to consider and investigate alternative options.

Potentially they could be practicing the 'wrong' things. Practice doesn't make perfect, it makes permanent.

Kinda... but you're thinking way too much in your teacher mode there. In simple terms it's VERY different riding on track and it simply can take time to work out things like apex's, cornering, leaning, power... It's not so much doing the wrong things, just a learning curve.

[Horse]

Sometimes people need a bit of practise before they start going fast.

Only if they know - and understand- what they should be doing. Not everyone will be able to consider and investigate alternative options.

Potentially they could be practicing the 'wrong' things. Practice doesn't make perfect, it makes permanent.

Kinda... but you're thinking way too much in your teacher mode there. In simple terms it's VERY different riding on track and it simply can take time to work out things like apex's, cornering, leaning, power... It's not so much doing the wrong things, just a learning curve.

Yup, you're quite right about how I think - 40 years involvement in rider training, one way or another, will do that

The track sessions I've done were not typical 'track days' (one was a limited group size of just 5 riders at a time, another was with instruction), so I don't know how much training is typically provided for novices.

But if they don't know the basics of getting around any bend (road or track) before they get out there, and - from some of the Pembrey video - either haven't taken on board any lines/positioning briefing or don't have the confidence to use that knowledge, then is that a failing?

I don't know details of the event, apart from three groups. Was it 3x sessions of 20 laps, per group? Perhaps people do improve with time but, as you might expect, I've seen plenty on road who needed help, so it would seem reasonable - to me, anyway - to have more help provided for those who need it, whether or not they ask (some won't want to, others won't realise the potential benefits). That way they get better quickly and can benefit more from the time.

[weeksy]

Only if they know - and understand- what they should be doing. Not everyone will be able to consider and investigate alternative options.

Potentially they could be practicing the 'wrong' things. Practice doesn't make perfect, it makes permanent.

Kinda... but you're thinking way too much in your teacher mode there. In simple terms it's VERY different riding on track and it simply can take time to work out things like apex's, cornering, leaning, power... It's not so much doing the wrong things, just a learning curve.

Yup, you're quite right about how I think - 40 years involvement in rider training, one way or another, will do that

The track sessions I've done were not typical 'track days' (one was a limited group size of just 5 riders at a time, another was with instruction), so I don't know how much training is typically provided for novices.

But if they don't know the basics of getting around any bend (road or track) before they get out there, and - from some of the Pembrey video) either haven't taken on board any lines/positioning briefing or don't have the confidence to use that knowledge, then is that a failing?

I don't know details of the event, apart from three groups. Was it 3x sessions of 20 laps, per group? Perhaps people do improve with time but, as you might expect, I've seen plenty on road who needed help, so it would seem reasonable - to me, anyway - to have more help provided for those who need it, whether or not they ask (some won't want to, others won't realise the potential benefits). That way they get better quickly and can benefit more from the time.

Whilst it is possible to get instruction/help/guidance, it's honestly VERY uncommon for riders to do so, even though it's mostly free of cost.

Usually 3 groups and 20 mins, so you'll get 8 laps at Cadwell in novice per session.

[Horse]

Whilst it is possible to get instruction/help/guidance, it's honestly VERY uncommon for riders to do so,

That's a shame.

[weeksy]

Whilst it is possible to get instruction/help/guidance, it's honestly VERY uncommon for riders to do so,

That's a shame.

They're guys.. that's the first downside, there's also the "i'm already great" factor... Throw in the quality of instruction at times... IT means most don't bother.

But take for example on of our forum lads Dodgy Knees... He went from near the back end of novice on his first time on track, to near the front of the group last weekend, i'm not sure that's all down to the fact in the last 2 years he's improved as a motorcyclist, but more than with this being his 3rd time on track, you simple get better/quicker by doing it more than once.

Faster doesn't necessarily mean riders have got 'better' than previous times as such, but that they've learned you can go quicker.

[IOU0]

MLCP_180331_124920_1294 by Tony H, on Flickr

That's a cool looking Royal Enfi............ah

[Horse]

Faster doesn't necessarily mean riders have got 'better' than previous times as such, but that they've learned you can go quicker.

Yup, having the confidence to use skills and knowledge.

[lostboy]

I go away for a few years and come back and absolutely f**k all has changed. Couchy is still averaging about 10 bikes a year

[weeksy]

I go away for a few years and come back and absolutely f**k all has changed. Couchy is still averaging about 10 bikes a year

I don't own a KTM !!!

[lostboy]

I go away for a few years and come back and absolutely f**k all has changed. Couchy is still averaging about 10 bikes a year

I don't own a KTM !!!

It was a good job I was sitting down when I read that thread. Nothing could have prepared me for you NOT having anything orange in the garage!

[Couchy]

I go away for a few years and come back and absolutely f**k all has changed. Couchy is still averaging about 10 bikes a year

I don't own a KTM !!!

It was a good job I was sitting down when I read that thread. Nothing could have prepared me for you NOT having anything orange in the garage!

There’s something orange he gets spray tanned

[Taipan]

A fast rider on a slow bike is always going to be faster than a muppet with an R1.
Looks likenyou had fun tho, which is the most important thing!

I think people are being a bit unfair, it was clear that most of those people had probably never been on a track before, and even if you're a competent road rider you're still going to be taking bad lines on a track until you know your way around.

Good points. I'm always hearing you should do track. Days and people worrying that they'd not be fast/experienced enough and the replies are always, it's not racing and that's why they're are different groups to accommodate people's different levels.. After reading some of the replies here I'm glad I never bothered!

[weeksy]

Good points. I'm always hearing you should do track. Days and people worrying that they'd not be fast/experienced enough and the replies are always, it's not racing and that's why they're are different groups to accommodate people's different levels.. After reading some of the replies here I'm glad I never bothered!

IME most people are ok, but there is definitely an element on the day that comes in after every session tutting at the slow people who apparently aren't worthy of being on the same track as them.

Equally there are the blokes on brand new kit that think they're way faster than they are and get terribly upset if you pass them on a much older/slower bike.

IME it's much more fun and way less judgemental to actually go racing, even if you come last by some margin no one will take the piss because you had the balls to get onto the start line in the first place (especially in motocross where it's brutal) but on trackdays you'll always get egos for some reason.

I hear you, but really it's very very rarely like that on the day. It can be like that in the after-track discussions on-line of course, but a lage chunk of Couchies was tongue in cheek, he's a fast lad, whether on a slow bike or not. The problem he has is that at times even in slow groups there are stupidly fast bikes on the straight bits, giving a massive difference in straight line speed. So we can sit here and say he booked the completely wrong group, but we could also argue there wasn't a 'right' groups for an Enfield ridden by a fast guy. So the lines become slightly blurred. In these circumstances there's no right answer other than "don't take an Enfield" but that's his choice.

If i'm being harsh, some of his overtakes in the group he was in were a bit too strong for the experience of the riders he was passing... But by the same account they were of course 'safe' but could easily freak a few riders out.

[YoKaiser]

MLCP_180331_115552_0646 by Tony H, on Flickr

That is quality really great pic

[Couchy]

Good points. I'm always hearing you should do track. Days and people worrying that they'd not be fast/experienced enough and the replies are always, it's not racing and that's why they're are different groups to accommodate people's different levels.. After reading some of the replies here I'm glad I never bothered!

IME most people are ok, but there is definitely an element on the day that comes in after every session tutting at the slow people who apparently aren't worthy of being on the same track as them.

Equally there are the blokes on brand new kit that think they're way faster than they are and get terribly upset if you pass them on a much older/slower bike.

IME it's much more fun and way less judgemental to actually go racing, even if you come last by some margin no one will take the piss because you had the balls to get onto the start line in the first place (especially in motocross where it's brutal) but on trackdays you'll always get egos for some reason.

I hear you, but really it's very very rarely like that on the day. It can be like that in the after-track discussions on-line of course, but a lage chunk of Couchies was tongue in cheek, he's a fast lad, whether on a slow bike or not. The problem he has is that at times even in slow groups there are stupidly fast bikes on the straight bits, giving a massive difference in straight line speed. So we can sit here and say he booked the completely wrong group, but we could also argue there wasn't a 'right' groups for an Enfield ridden by a fast guy. So the lines become slightly blurred. In these circumstances there's no right answer other than "don't take an Enfield" but that's his choice.

If i'm being harsh, some of his overtakes in the group he was in were a bit too strong for the experience of the riders he was passing... But by the same account they were of course 'safe' but could easily freak a few riders out.

I’d be interested which overtakes you think were a bit strong as they were all fine with no complaints made, maybe the video made them look worse ?
But you’re right about the Enfield, and also there was no way I was going in a group where bikes would be doing 160 mph over the crest on the back straight only to find me doing 95mph, that never ends well.

[weeksy]

10:42

[Couchy]

10:42

Those 2 and me had been ‘battling’ all session and had been passed 2 or 3 times already and they had passed back on the straights. They weren’t nervous novices, tbh even if they were that overtake was fine.

[Yorick]

10:42

Looked OK to me. That's always been one of my favourite passing places

[Couchy]

Thinking how much I enjoyed the trackday on the little bike decided to go a whole lot further, wets on wheels, power commander, ohlins shock, andreani kit, fairing, monoshock, quick shifter and rearsets. Basically make it a proper little race bike and I have to say the finished bike is awesome




































Untitled by Tony H, on Flickr

[Couchy]

Back to the enfield

Little updates, found some AP racing sintered race pads so ordered them up. I'll swap fluid to some RBF and I'm tempted to swap master cylinder for a brembo radial. Also ordered a cam to add another 5hp and I'll get the power commander on and mapped. Should net nearly 60hp at the wheel, exhaust is still being modified then I'll drop on some medium compound racetec classic race tyres. I'm tempted to go the whole way and put a classic race fairing on to add a few mph which may come in handy at Portimao....