By-elections

Current affairs, Politics, News.
Lutin
Posts: 397
Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2020 4:52 pm
Location: Just across the border in the Republic
Has thanked: 170 times
Been thanked: 157 times

By-elections

Post by Lutin »

Anyone want to hazard a guess as to by how much the tories will lose today's two by-elections?
Blundering about trying not to make too much of a hash of things.
User avatar
Pirahna
Posts: 615
Joined: Wed Mar 25, 2020 7:31 pm
Has thanked: 554 times
Been thanked: 369 times

Re: By-elections

Post by Pirahna »

Not by as much as you think. There's plenty of people out there convinced Brexit is a great idea, Boris has done a fantastic job with covid, is doing a great job with the economy, so what if he had a few parties in lockdown, I'd do the same in that situation, etc, etc.
Count Steer
Posts: 3343
Joined: Mon Jul 19, 2021 4:59 pm
Location: Top o' the world Ma.
Has thanked: 2035 times
Been thanked: 1397 times

Re: By-elections

Post by Count Steer »

Lose one by a margin that they'll claim is 'not too bad' and 'what you'd expect in a by-election at this point in the electoral cycle'. Win the other by the skin of their teeth on a low turnout and claim 'it's a triumph for a by-election at this point in the electoral cycle'.
My spine is the bass line.
User avatar
mangocrazy
Posts: 1316
Joined: Tue Dec 22, 2020 9:58 pm
Has thanked: 439 times
Been thanked: 696 times

Re: By-elections

Post by mangocrazy »

Whatever the result Boris will claim it as a positive and the BBC, Sky and the papers will go along with it.
Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana.
User avatar
gremlin
Posts: 2488
Joined: Wed Jul 08, 2020 3:12 pm
Location: Kent (AKA God's own country)
Has thanked: 268 times
Been thanked: 1895 times

Re: By-elections

Post by gremlin »

By-elections tend to be about protest voters being galvanised into action. The truth of it is that 90% of the voters are dyed-in-the-wool supports of their favoured party and will never vote for 'the other lot', so cast their vote to some obscure candidate. It's what the Lib Dems were invented for.

Take my mum. Reads the DM, rails against illegal immigrants and work-shy dole scroungers and lazy striking binmen/posties/train drivers/etc. but puts a Vote Labour sticker in her window when elections come around as she's 'working class and proud'.
Tart 1b - robbed of first place by the Mockney Geezer.
Mussels
Posts: 2179
Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2020 9:02 pm
Has thanked: 387 times
Been thanked: 606 times

Re: By-elections

Post by Mussels »

A summer of strikes looming and labour MPs stood on the picket lines, it's as if they are scared of winning too many seats or very complacent.
User avatar
DefTrap
Posts: 2101
Joined: Tue Apr 14, 2020 8:23 am
Has thanked: 1063 times
Been thanked: 923 times

Re: By-elections

Post by DefTrap »

This government is as greasy as an oiled pig. Black is White. Wrong is Right.

At this point Boris would have to be caught throwing it up a minor for it to spur the party faithful into think maybe, just maybe, he's not the right guy for the job.
User avatar
Horse
Posts: 6197
Joined: Sun Mar 15, 2020 11:30 am
Location: Always sunny southern England
Has thanked: 2772 times
Been thanked: 2388 times

Re: By-elections

Post by Horse »

Mussels wrote: Thu Jun 23, 2022 4:23 pm A summer of strikes looming and labour MPs stood on the picket lines, it's as if they are scared of winning too many seats or very complacent.
Imminent recession?
Rampant inflation.
Brexit done - but NI protocol to sort.
etc.

Would you want to be in the government?

Make your name as a good 'local', MP for constituency work, but keeping out of 'power' seems sensible :)
Even bland can be a type of character :wave:
Lutin
Posts: 397
Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2020 4:52 pm
Location: Just across the border in the Republic
Has thanked: 170 times
Been thanked: 157 times

Re: By-elections

Post by Lutin »

A stunning victory for the tories then. ;)
Blundering about trying not to make too much of a hash of things.
User avatar
DefTrap
Posts: 2101
Joined: Tue Apr 14, 2020 8:23 am
Has thanked: 1063 times
Been thanked: 923 times

Re: By-elections

Post by DefTrap »

More water off a ducks back.

Is it a protest about this shambolic government?
Is it a protest about Boris? (What's worse than shambolic by the way?)

Look at Abbot's shoes though! And Sir Keir ate a curry!
Mr Moofo
Posts: 1970
Joined: Sat Mar 14, 2020 1:41 pm
Location: Brightonish
Has thanked: 745 times
Been thanked: 649 times

Re: By-elections

Post by Mr Moofo »

The sad fact is now that even with the electorate deciding that Boris is a lying and untrustworthy PM, as well as a hopeless leader, the Cons have nothing else.
The really sad issue is that Boris will survive , because Labour are even worse
User avatar
mangocrazy
Posts: 1316
Joined: Tue Dec 22, 2020 9:58 pm
Has thanked: 439 times
Been thanked: 696 times

Re: By-elections

Post by mangocrazy »

Mr Moofo wrote: Fri Jun 24, 2022 9:55 am The sad fact is now that even with the electorate deciding that Boris is a lying and untrustworthy PM, as well as a hopeless leader, the Cons have nothing else.
The really sad issue is that Boris will survive , because Labour are even worse
Define 'worse'. Starmer is pretty dull, but to infer that he is worse than Johnson is plainly ridiculous. He hasn't based his entire life and career on lying, as Boris has. Prior to becoming an MP he was the director of Public Prosecutions. You don't get to rise that far up the legal profession by being a serial liar.

All your statement really means is that 'despite Boris being a lying and untrustworthy PM, as well as a hopeless leader I'm still voting Tory'.
Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana.
Count Steer
Posts: 3343
Joined: Mon Jul 19, 2021 4:59 pm
Location: Top o' the world Ma.
Has thanked: 2035 times
Been thanked: 1397 times

Re: By-elections

Post by Count Steer »

Mr Moofo wrote: Fri Jun 24, 2022 9:55 am The sad fact is now that even with the electorate deciding that Boris is a lying and untrustworthy PM, as well as a hopeless leader, the Cons have nothing else.
359? MPs and not one of them capable of putting a cabinet with a mixture of competence, honesty and decency together? That's a vote winner. :lol:
My spine is the bass line.
Mussels
Posts: 2179
Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2020 9:02 pm
Has thanked: 387 times
Been thanked: 606 times

Re: By-elections

Post by Mussels »

mangocrazy wrote: Fri Jun 24, 2022 11:01 am
Mr Moofo wrote: Fri Jun 24, 2022 9:55 am The sad fact is now that even with the electorate deciding that Boris is a lying and untrustworthy PM, as well as a hopeless leader, the Cons have nothing else.
The really sad issue is that Boris will survive , because Labour are even worse
Define 'worse'. Starmer is pretty dull, but to infer that he is worse than Johnson is plainly ridiculous. He hasn't based his entire life and career on lying, as Boris has. Prior to becoming an MP he was the director of Public Prosecutions. You don't get to rise that far up the legal profession by being a serial liar.

All your statement really means is that 'despite Boris being a lying and untrustworthy PM, as well as a hopeless leader I'm still voting Tory'.
I don't think Starmer is worse, I quite like him. I think labour is worse and Starmer is just a moderate puppet for show with little control.
User avatar
DefTrap
Posts: 2101
Joined: Tue Apr 14, 2020 8:23 am
Has thanked: 1063 times
Been thanked: 923 times

Re: By-elections

Post by DefTrap »

Mr Moofo wrote: Fri Jun 24, 2022 9:55 am The really sad issue is that Boris will survive , because Labour are even worse
Well the papers say so. But the age-old threat of "Labour will tax you to death" seems rather hollow now ...

The hilarious bit is we -knew- Boris was terrible - a horror-show of political, personal and career gaffes, and a congenital liar - yet we still elected him and we still, quite likely the majority of the electorate and his own MPs, want to keep him and are fine with his bullshit. We only have ourselves to blame.

But yeah obviously that guy Starmer who's so vanilla that eating a curry is news, is worse. Oh yes - champagne socialist! So he's a hypocrite! And Abbotts shoes. And probably they're all antisemitic obviously.

However I totally agree that Labour shot themselves in the foot allowing the pathetic 'party faithful' middle class militants appear to take over. That's going to take time to get over.
Last edited by DefTrap on Fri Jun 24, 2022 12:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
mangocrazy
Posts: 1316
Joined: Tue Dec 22, 2020 9:58 pm
Has thanked: 439 times
Been thanked: 696 times

Re: By-elections

Post by mangocrazy »

Mussels wrote: Fri Jun 24, 2022 11:28 am
mangocrazy wrote: Fri Jun 24, 2022 11:01 am
Mr Moofo wrote: Fri Jun 24, 2022 9:55 am The sad fact is now that even with the electorate deciding that Boris is a lying and untrustworthy PM, as well as a hopeless leader, the Cons have nothing else.
The really sad issue is that Boris will survive , because Labour are even worse
Define 'worse'. Starmer is pretty dull, but to infer that he is worse than Johnson is plainly ridiculous. He hasn't based his entire life and career on lying, as Boris has. Prior to becoming an MP he was the director of Public Prosecutions. You don't get to rise that far up the legal profession by being a serial liar.

All your statement really means is that 'despite Boris being a lying and untrustworthy PM, as well as a hopeless leader I'm still voting Tory'.
I don't think Starmer is worse, I quite like him. I think labour is worse and Starmer is just a moderate puppet for show with little control.
You also haven't defined 'worse'. And Starmer is no puppet - he's been instigating a purge of what the tabloids call the hard left and pissing off a lot of Labour activists. The Corbynistas are now an endangered species within Labour, and the man himself has been effectively banished. That's not the actions of a puppet.
Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana.
Le_Fromage_Grande
Posts: 6860
Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2020 6:40 pm
Location: The road of many manky motorcycles
Has thanked: 390 times
Been thanked: 2260 times

Re: By-elections

Post by Le_Fromage_Grande »

Labour won't win a General Election, that's how they're worse, they're less trust worthy than the Conservatives, you've no idea what you're voting for with Labour.
Making everyone happy is impossible, but annoying everyone is easy and a lot more fun.
Mussels
Posts: 2179
Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2020 9:02 pm
Has thanked: 387 times
Been thanked: 606 times

Re: By-elections

Post by Mussels »

Nobody has defined worse so far, it means different things to different people.
You think Starmer is getting rid of socialists too quickly, I think they still have too much influence for labour to be credible. The unions have too much power and their only interests are increasing their subs and power.
Mussels
Posts: 2179
Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2020 9:02 pm
Has thanked: 387 times
Been thanked: 606 times

Re: By-elections

Post by Mussels »

I'm not against unions, I'm against them making noise for the sake of it. BA staff have a good reason for going on strike, the railway staff can get stuffed.
User avatar
DefTrap
Posts: 2101
Joined: Tue Apr 14, 2020 8:23 am
Has thanked: 1063 times
Been thanked: 923 times

Re: By-elections

Post by DefTrap »

Le_Fromage_Grande wrote: Fri Jun 24, 2022 1:37 pm Labour won't win a General Election, that's how they're worse, they're less trust worthy than the Conservatives, you've no idea what you're voting for with Labour.
Mussels wrote: Fri Jun 24, 2022 1:41 pm Nobody has defined worse so far, it means different things to different people.
You think Starmer is getting rid of socialists too quickly, I think they still have too much influence for labour to be credible. The unions have too much power and their only interests are increasing their subs and power.
This is just the old project fear angle, so hugely derided. You don't -know- that, you're just guessing.

The icing on the cake is we know that the Tories are a shambles. Looking just past Boris, we know that their front bench is a horror show - Dorries, Patel, Rees-Mogg, Gove, Shapps - we get to see their stupid, misguided and downright inhumane actual policies every day. The front bench is SO bad that Shifty Sunak is a genuine contender for party leadership, despite his blatant corruption and outside interests. Maybe because any of the genuinely decent and competent ones won't put up with Boris's nonsense.

But yeah the terrible Tory government is probably Labour and Liberal fault for not upping their game and taking advantage of this massive black hole of ability