Business Question

[Noggin]

Ok, possibly daft to ask online, but talked to a friend this evening who had a completely different opinion to the one I expected from him. So thought I'd ask here as quite a few of you are business minded (probably more so than me, and definitely more experienced!!)


Anyway - I put my business on hold for this year due to mental issues connected to menopause (brain melted and was totally useless for about 10 months, getting better now!) and also the issues brought on by Covid and Brexit (Covid, the uncertainty for the travel/tourist industry; Brexit, when I was supposed to sort out vehicles I didn't have residency or an EU passport)

Historically, I've not made any money yet mostly due to renting minibuses, not buying, also having a smashed up shoulder that probably did distract me a lot (even though I worked a SERIOUS number of hours!!)

The business plan is good. I can make it work. But after 5 years of struggling to survive ( the first year I worked for someone that didn't pay us for the last 2 months, the last 4 years, it was all on me - and a seriously negative bank, to the point of being destructive!!) it's been a LOT of a relief this winter to know I have a wage coming in each month.

I'm currently looking for a summer job I want some security for the summer too, to pay back my debts/bills and the chance to save up a bit to give myself a buffer


Soooo - the plan had been to restart next winter 2022/2023. But TBH I'm starting to think I should continue with the job I'm doing now for another winter (they've said they would be very happy to have me back)

- It will give me another year to find out if I can easily employ the people I would like, and also have them be able to do the job in and out of Switzerland
- But also because that will also give me another summer of working for someone else - so 18 months (after this winter) of earning properly, clearing bills/debts, saving, putting the business plan back together, sorting vehicles, redoing the website, sort the mailing list etc etc etc


Some friends have been pushing me to get myself sorted for this coming winter but I am leaning towards taking the extra year to make sure I'm financially stable and ready to be an employer and do the business properly

Is my preference sensible?

[Felix]

Having a wife with over 10 years of menopause and mental health issues i say always do the one that gives you less stress and worry.

[Yorick]

Just take the money and run. No need for any hassle.

[Noggin]

Having a wife with over 10 years of menopause and mental health issues i say always do the one that gives you less stress and worry.

It's pretty much sorted with HRT - just need one more thing that I can't get here in France, but can get privately in the UK, when I visit in May (ish)

So, in theory, I will be fine by June, when I need to decide for certain!

Just take the money and run. No need for any hassle.

Yes, but the business was always my plan as a pension - work in it then manage it and get others to do the worst bit!!

But, I am liking the lack of stress this season for sure!!

[Mussels]

Will your business make you considerably richer? If not is it really worth the risk and stress?

I have my own company and was a freelancer for years, now I'm employed as working for myself isn't likely to bring in enough extra money to be worth the stress.

[Count Steer]

I think I'd take the job for another year and find out if this virus really is going to be like flu and pop its ugly head up in a new form each winter. If so there should be a vaccine programme like flu by the following year. Certainly would want a bit more clarity before sinking ££s into a bus.

[Noggin]

Will your business make you considerably richer? If not is it really worth the risk and stress?

I have my own company and was a freelancer for years, now I'm employed as working for myself isn't likely to bring in enough extra money to be worth the stress.

Probably not considerably. But it would give me some security in old age as an income when I don't drive anymore (if I build it to a handful of vehicles and get it running as it should)

Will then mean I can ski, do office work and let someone else sit in traffic!!

The balance is that I won't have enough years of work/tax here to get a full French pension, so having something that creates an income would be useful

I think I'd take the job for another year and find out if this virus really is going to be like flu and pop its ugly head up in a new form each winter. If so there should be a vaccine programme like flu by the following year. Certainly would want a bit more clarity before sinking ££s into a bus.

Covid is another stress. As a small business/solo operator I really couldn't have dealt with/survived the various issues this season (personally either!!)

[demographic]

It's not a competition, do whichever is best for YOU.

[wheelnut]

Honestly, if you’ve struggled to make it work for the last 5 years then there’s a good chance you’ll struggle for the next 5.

Stick with the wage coming in, you know where you are and the stress is minimal.

[Pirahna]

Is HRT forever?

I'd stick with the paying jobs.

[Jody]

I was self employed for 9 years, followed by 12 years of seasonal contracts. I'd be very hard pushed to go se again. Yes it's a bit more money, yes it technically gives you more freedom. But being employed gives a regular wage, sensible hours, less stress and if you're mini bus blows up, it's not your problem !

[weeksy]

I'm afraid i'm with the majority on this. I've always taken the 'safe' route in terms of employment. I could have gone contracting in IT back in the day, long hours, big commutes into London, big wages. But instead i kept with my safe, nice, secure (ish) job.

It's only now that i have more freedom, money, time and have my lad growing up that i fully appreciate it.

I'd take the job, but try and get a better job within that job, or even outside of it.. it's a LOT easier looking for a job when you already have a wage coming in.

[Mr. Dazzle]

Stuff

Hard to disagree with the man, based purely on what I've seen from the outside.

I've worked for several small firms run by the founders/owners. Two of them have been sold to large corporations while I was working there.

I've also known loads of colleagues who've left salaried jobs to go contracting or start their own consultancies.

One of the really big reasons I've not done similar is that I've no motivation to do "business stuff". I do loads and loads of hours and I love my job, but I only love the core element of it. If you're running it as a business I reckon at least half of it (probably more) is nothing at all to do with the core activities. It's all the other elements of running a business, which is all stuff I have zero motivation to do. It would he actual grinding work from my POV, not something I've done in years

I'm not gonna offer an opinion on what you should do though Noggin, I really think this is something for you to decide.

[Count Steer]

I'm afraid i'm with the majority on this. I've always taken the 'safe' route in terms of employment. I could have gone contracting in IT back in the day, long hours, big commutes into London, big wages. But instead i kept with my safe, nice, secure (ish) job.

It's only now that i have more freedom, money, time and have my lad growing up that i fully appreciate it.

I'd take the job, but try and get a better job within that job, or even outside of it.. it's a LOT easier looking for a job when you already have a wage coming in.

I left one job and started another (both London based). Several of the contractors that I had on the first team came and took permie jobs on my new team. People think that contracting is a path paved with gold and forget about boring stuff like paid leave, training, sickness, career path ie pay increases through promotion and the little matter of pension contributions.

[Noggin]

Honestly, if you’ve struggled to make it work for the last 5 years then there’s a good chance you’ll struggle for the next 5.

Stick with the wage coming in, you know where you are and the stress is minimal.

I made some bad decisions in the last 4 years (the first year I worked for someone else!!) and also had an unhelpful/destructive bank manager - I now have a lot more knowledge and am learning a lot where I am, and have an incredibly helpful and supportive bank!! Doing it right shouldn't be a struggle. Hard work, but not a struggle!

Is HRT forever?

I'd stick with the paying jobs.

Oh yes. But once the hormones are balanced, I'm back to being me, or at least, an older version but less messed up than the last year or so!! I am also no longer in constant pain, that's a definite bonus!!

I was self employed for 9 years, followed by 12 years of seasonal contracts. I'd be very hard pushed to go se again. Yes it's a bit more money, yes it technically gives you more freedom. But being employed gives a regular wage, sensible hours, less stress and if you're mini bus blows up, it's not your problem !

I get that. But it really was the main goal when I moved here. I'm happy doing a job for someone else, but there have been a few weekends this season where I'm thinking that I'm working as hard but for someone else. Which sort of bugs me a bit!! LOL

I'm afraid i'm with the majority on this. I've always taken the 'safe' route in terms of employment. I could have gone contracting in IT back in the day, long hours, big commutes into London, big wages. But instead i kept with my safe, nice, secure (ish) job.

It's only now that i have more freedom, money, time and have my lad growing up that i fully appreciate it.

I'd take the job, but try and get a better job within that job, or even outside of it.. it's a LOT easier looking for a job when you already have a wage coming in.

I think the major difference is that I have no one. I have no family here to spend time with and already live in an amazing place. No commute. Any time off is spent skiing (or biking in the summer!)

My apartment doesn't cost much to live in, yes I'd like somewhere bigger, but on that basis, I need to earn a lot more than I would for someone else!!

But, I totally get what you're saying.

My honest advice - if you are not absolutely motivated and focussed with a laser beam vision on building and growing your business, then you'll fail.
It's very rare that people succeed by accident or by being half-arsed.

If you are utterly focussed and single minded on achieving something then eventually you will succeed, if you are not, then you won't.
I joke about it but it's true, it's all out there for you but unless you're living and breathing it even in your sleep then you'll only get back the reflection of what you put in.

If you're focussed on success then ask yourself, is this a job or is this who I am?

One of the things that always amuses me is when people point out to me that I'm exactly the same out of work as I am at work, they seem surprised at this.
It's because I've found something where all I have to do is be me, I don't work, I just be me, 24/7.

Is it who you are or is it a job, and IMHO if it's a job then do it for someone else.

I was. I couldn't be for the last year due to the mental issues - and also lack of residency/EU passport at the time that I needed to also be able to use my brain!!!

I had been the business for 4 years - lived, breathed, worked, loved. But I made some shit decisions. Partly lack of knowledge, partly shoulder distraction and partly because I didn't ask people, didn't have anyone to bounce ideas off and did kinda tie myself in knots focussing on the end goal without giving myself space to bend to different directions when I should have

I bloody love my job. Ok, some drivers will always BMP. Traffic jams suck big time. But, I do love my job. It combines a number of things I like - talking to people, helping people, driving, seeing sunrise/sunset, driving through amazing areas. And I do REALLY want this to work



The question wasn't really should I quit my business and work for someone else forever or not.

The question was more, is a delay of a year sensible or will it make the whole thing impossible


I really appreciate all your replies. @Potter extra thank yous. Reading that made me realise how much I want it. How much it means to make it work. And, how much I love doing the job

BUT - everything I've read here makes me also realise that this time I have to do it properly. AND that means not going in half arsed again. It means I have to sort my life and finances out and THEN go back in hitting the ground running. Which also gives me time to work out how to employ the people I want or find replacement people with the right passport!!!

I also have a bit of a support network here now and people to talk, to ask advice and get support from


I'm sure that during/after next season I'll be chucking up some more questions, but in a much more positive and proactive way


You guys ROCK - love you all

[Cousin Jack]

Yes, own company is not always the path paved with gold. I have done both, they each have advantages and disadvantages, only you can decide which is best for you.

I am not going to tell Noggin what to do, just offer a warning that most small companies (and some big ones) fail because they run out of cash. They may be profitable, but at the end of the day if the bank account is empty you are in a hole. Starting any business means spending money up front, the income comes later, often MUCH later. If you decide to go back to running your own business make sure you have enough cash to get past the start-up phase (which will be at least a year) and some extra to cover the late payers/bad debts. If your customers are big companies be very aware that some of them, particularly in the airline/travel business, have a shocking reputation for paying late.

Good luck Noggin, whichever way you decide.

[Count Steer]

If you do decide to go with your own business you'll need to think about resilience. Less of a problem if you're going to employ people or have a go-to stand-in. If you're a one-woman business though, what happens if you're sick? It might put a crimp on activities like hang-gliding if you think a sprained ankle means the business grinds to a halt but costs keep coming in.

Find a business partner? Look for/work for a small outfit that you could buy into/take over?

Whatever you decide, hope it all works out bonzer.

[Noggin]

If you do decide to go with your own business you'll need to think about resilience. Less of a problem if you're going to employ people or have a go-to stand-in. If you're a one-woman business though, what happens if you're sick? It might put a crimp on activities like hang-gliding if you think a sprained ankle means the business grinds to a halt but costs keep coming in.

Find a business partner? Look for/work for a small outfit that you could buy into/take over?

Whatever you decide, hope it all works out bonzer.

TBF, that was always an issue. I had to drive regardless of how much pain I was in. Made everything more difficult

If/when I do start up again, I would do it with two vehicles so would have me and a n other - but I would also find someone that wanted to do a few hours a week but was willing to stand in for illness as well

There is someone I know that has a similar one van business, so could be worth talking to him and seeing if we can join forces. Maybe!! I also know someone that might do the office stuff.

But what you've said is one of the very big lessons I learnt. It's all very well doing it on your own, but there's no security for something going wrong (the guy I know with a one van business is married, so he mostly drives and she does a lot of the office stuff - leaves him much less stressed!!)

If I give myself another year, I can find the right people and set up and do it well this time.



Weirdly, despite deciding to wait another year, I'm sooooo positive about making it work this time!!

[Noggin]

Yes, own company is not always the path paved with gold. I have done both, they each have advantages and disadvantages, only you can decide which is best for you.

I am not going to tell Noggin what to do, just offer a warning that most small companies (and some big ones) fail because they run out of cash. They may be profitable, but at the end of the day if the bank account is empty you are in a hole. Starting any business means spending money up front, the income comes later, often MUCH later. If you decide to go back to running your own business make sure you have enough cash to get past the start-up phase (which will be at least a year) and some extra to cover the late payers/bad debts. If your customers are big companies be very aware that some of them, particularly in the airline/travel business, have a shocking reputation for paying late.

Good luck Noggin, whichever way you decide.

That is another reason in the back of mind (now closer to the front) to take an extra year and do it 'properly'!! I do have some good contacts but also lost money the year we were shut by Covid due to my biggest customer going bust and unable to pay the invoices in full (he did pay 50% which was better than I could have hoped for) - and they paid every 2 weeks, so usually pretty damned good!!

[Big Red]

Also worth reminding that employing people will cost you money.
Extra insurance, damage/neglect to your vehicle,(they will not treat it as you would as it isn't their property) and of course wages.
You would need to be making a sizable profit on the runs you were not doing the driving yourself for this to work financially for you.
If not it is to easy to run a business to pay other peoples wages without it being financially profitable for you.
Just my opinion from employing and running a business for 31 years, but good luck whatever you decide.