Hypothetical Track Bike Build - Hornet 600

[Mr. Dazzle]

Don't blame me just 'cause you guys can't think of any ways to save weight.

[KungFooBob]

I do like a Hornet.

I think one would make a great sit up and beg track bike.

Not too much power, but more than a CB500.

They're dirt cheap and there's loads of bits about should you bin it.

If I had room in the garage I'd buy one!

[Mr. Dazzle]

T'was the first "big" bike I rode on the road, my Mum had one.

You could be as cool as my Mum.

[KungFooBob]

T'was the first "big" bike I rode on the road, my Mum had one.

You could be as cool as my Mum.

My Mum had a TS50X (when I had a Honda Melody), every couple of months she'd let me use it for a trip. It was a great honour.

She traded it for a Derbi Senda 50, man that was quick (for a 50cc).

[Supermofo]

I've always harboured a strange desire to buy an SV 650 and get JHS to build me a road minitwin. I reckon a lightened, tuned, well suspended SV would make an awesome road/track bike.

[Mr. Dazzle]

T'was the first "big" bike I rode on the road, my Mum had one.

You could be as cool as my Mum.

My Mum had a TS50X (when I had a Honda Melody), every couple of months she'd let me use it for a trip. It was a great honour.

She traded it for a Derbi Senda 50, man that was quick (for a 50cc).

Shes got a CB500R now...clearly a Hornet is too much. She had other bikes in the middle though

[KungFooBob]

I've always harboured a strange desire to buy an SV 650 and get JHS to build me a road minitwin. I reckon a lightened, tuned, well suspended SV would make an awesome road/track bike.

169kg Dry.

25bhp down on the Hornet, but JHS recon they can get 95-100bhp from a Gladius motor.

I wonder how light a typical minitwin racer is?

[Skub]

I've always harboured a strange desire to buy an SV 650 and get JHS to build me a road minitwin. I reckon a lightened, tuned, well suspended SV would make an awesome road/track bike.

169kg Dry.

25bhp down on the Hornet, but JHS recon they can get 95-100bhp from a Gladius motor.

I wonder how light a typical minitwin racer is?

IOM lightweight class rules state. 'The smaller bikes will have a minimum weight of 150kg while the larger, over 651cc machines must weigh 160kg or more'.

[Couchy]

I’ve had two ex race bikes and one track bike I built. With proper suspension and sticky tyres they are a good laugh. I’d have another for this years classic bike days

[weeksy]

I’ve had two ex race bikes and one track bike I built. With proper suspension and sticky tyres they are a good laugh. I’d have another for this years classic bike days

I think I rode one at Donny years ago

[KungFooBob]

I’ve had two ex race bikes and one track bike I built. With proper suspension and sticky tyres they are a good laugh. I’d have another for this years classic bike days

I think the first time I met you, you had the worlds best suspended Hornet or something.

[Couchy]

I’ve had two ex race bikes and one track bike I built. With proper suspension and sticky tyres they are a good laugh. I’d have another for this years classic bike days

I think I rode one at Donny years ago

Maybe but it’ll be 20 years ago

[Couchy]

I’ve had two ex race bikes and one track bike I built. With proper suspension and sticky tyres they are a good laugh. I’d have another for this years classic bike days

I think the first time I met you, you had the worlds best suspended Hornet or something.

That one was done by ktech before they were big and were working out of a small unit with one person !

I’ve had a couple on my watch list to build again

[The Spin Doctor]

CBR engines don't fit straight in, the heads are different for the different carb angle.

They're not great handling either, a CBR handles better.

I think you'd be better off starting with a Fazer or a Bandit

I've ridden all three and the 17" front wheel Hornet handles well enough to get the pegs down easily with the right tyres to calm down its twitchiness on acceleration. Brakes are OK for road use - it'll stoppie easily enough on standard pads. You can improve the front end with better forks, and the rear shock is basic but it's not too shabby out of the crate - better IMO than either the Fazer (which has the legs on the Hornet) or the Bandit (which is slower, heavier and a much more ponderous steerer).

[The Spin Doctor]

Oh wow... that's not aged well... look at that swingarm !!! I always liked a Hornet... but that... just makes me barf.

Oi! I've still got my 2002 model

[The Spin Doctor]

You know, thinking about, just binning the road electrics would save you loads. It's a carb bike so all you really need for the track is a bit for the ignition. A big battery, starter motor, alternator and all the associated fat wiring adds up to quite a lot.

They have a tiny battery OE.

Mine runs a Shido Li-Fe LTX5 - I've just weighed it at 435g.

[Le_Fromage_Grande]

I've only ridden an early Hornet with the 16" front wheel, I really didn't like it, but I also don't like CBR600s.
Never ridden a Fazer, but I had an FZR600R, which was loads better than the same year CBR600, especially the engine.
I don't think I've ridden a Bandit of any variety, but I might have ridden a 1200, definitely never ridden a 600, followed race ones on track and they looked more composed than Hornets.

[The Spin Doctor]

I've ridden both the 16 and 17 inch wheel versions although my own is the 17". You can feel the difference between the two and the 17" is more stable, but it is still quite flighty - riding over the same set of ripples hard on the power on the Hornet and on my GSX-R750WN, the Suzuki was rock steady (as you'd expect from a bike that didn't like hairpins very much) whilst the Hornet was flappy. A buddy of mine got an immaculate early 16" model and swapped the wheel for the 17" almost immediately.

I have ridden several CBRs but not the FZR600R, so I can't compare those, only the later model FZS600 with the pointy fairing and both the CBRs and the Fazer weres definitely quicker than the Hornet.

We had a couple of late 90s 600 Bandits at the training school in Lydd for our 'big bike taster' courses which allowed them to try a variety of different styles so I quite often got to ride them when we took trainees out for those sessions - definitely not on the pace of the Hornet.

It's interesting looking back at just how much choice of bike there was back then.

[Le_Fromage_Grande]

It's interesting looking back at just how much choice of bike there was back then.

Yes, I was a bit surprised by the lack of choice when I decided to buy a modern bike last year, I was wondering round the shops thinking there must be more choice than this.

[Sideshow Pob]

So back in 2005 to 2008 I raced a Hornet at New Era. The class was regulated (not very well to be honest) and the engines had a 85bhp limit. Basically stock engines, stock air filters, stock headers and free choice of end can. Suspenders could be upgraded and so I had Ohlins in one bike and a Nitron in another. The forks had a mild K-tech upgrade without affecting the external appearance. These bikes really suffered with being overweight. Obviously all the lighting stuff was removed as well as sidestand, rear panels and grab handle but nothing to really get it from being a chubby bugger! I remember my best ever Cadwell lap on a Hornet was a 1.42 and Ivan Lintin did once manage a 1.39 before crashing trying to get a 1.38.

A few years later and I was racing at Bemsee on a carby SV650 in the Minitwins class. Similar rules (much better regulated) with stock engines and upgraded suspension. But of course an SV650 is so much lighter than a Hornet with arguably a better handling chassis too. My best Cadwell laptime on the SV was a 1.40 and the lap record is something like a 1.37 I think.

So personally, I'd opt for an SV over a Hornet for a bit of trackday fun as they are similar cost and it doesn't feel like you've gone 3 rounds with Tyson after each session, like it does with the Hornet.