Tax hike to pay for social care... not very Tory!

[Docca]

I'm happy to sit slagging off absolutely everything all day and every day like a blinkered baboon because that’s all I’ve got in my arsenal. Lazy managers lazy manager etc lulz my experience is the only path the truth

Fixed that for you

[Docca]

Every time I've been to an NHS appointment in recent years I've been the first patient of the day. They still manage to run late

I suspect its cultural more than anything. Being busy and late "is OK" so everyone just expects it.

Must be for physical health appointments, because for mental health we get blown to pieces if we are running late.

That’s not to say that we don’t occasionally run late.

As a comparison: the last few occasions we’ve tried to book a tradesmen on one of a variety of trusted apps- it seems perfectly acceptable for builders/tree surgeons/engineers to not turn up at all.

I’d say we’ve had about 4/10 show up. That’s not on time, that’s at all. Seems to be perfectly acceptable.

[Mr. Dazzle]

Mental health, broken bones, eyes, kids vaccinations and babies. Here and in London.

The actual hands on bit has always been pretty good, although it's generally obvious they are rushing to get you out. But the people charged with actually getting you in front of the Dr range from "DGAS" to bad enough that I wonder if they're actively resisting you sometimes.

[Docca]

Mental health, broken bones, eyes, kids vaccinations and babies. Here and in London.

The actual hands on bit has always been pretty good, although it's generally obvious they are rushing to get you out. But the people charged with actually getting you in front of the Dr range from "DGAS" to bad enough that I wonder if they're actively resisting you sometimes.

Yeah, my wife had to wait 8 hours for her 9am appointment at Guys and Tommies ( detached retina). That was sat in a waiting area, not being able to see with an urgent health need. 8 hours.

I don’t think that’s a reflection of a culture of people not caring about you ( self employed or otherwise) but just the pressure the system is under. On that day, they were 40% staff down.

Surprised about mental health. Our crisis services tend to struggle to see people on time ( because everything is in crisis) more than the outpatient clinics though.

[Mussels]

Every time I've been to an NHS appointment in recent years I've been the first patient of the day. They still manage to run late

I suspect its cultural more than anything. Being busy and late "is OK" so everyone just expects it.

Must be for physical health appointments, because for mental health we get blown to pieces if we are running late.

That’s not to say that we don’t occasionally run late.

As a comparison: the last few occasions we’ve tried to book a tradesmen on one of a variety of trusted apps- it seems perfectly acceptable for builders/tree surgeons/engineers to not turn up at all.

I’d say we’ve had about 4/10 show up. That’s not on time, that’s at all. Seems to be perfectly acceptable.

The difference there is you have a choice, I find service brokers like that are usually a bit rubbish. I have found ringing round and speaking to tradespeople directly gets me a better and cheaper service and once a relationship is established things get much less stressful.

Fwiw I've taken people to many hospital appointments over the last few years and don't remember waiting for long at any of them.

[Mr Moofo]

I wholeheartedly agree that there is a severe underinvestment in the NHS, I'm not talking primarily about funding though, I'm talking about a shake up of how it is managed and investing in management capability.

It has got better since things like the Aldar Hay, Bristol and Stafford scandals, but it's still a dinosaur that can't wash it's own face, and it's been that way for decades regardless of which political party has been in No.10.

Spot on :
The NHS may have funding issues - but it is certainly not helped by its own structure and management practices - and it ability to waste money like no other organisation.
270k to recruit a bunch more child execs. Tell you what. Let's just have one fro the whole of the NHS , pay him 500k and make him accountable. Why in god's name does it have to be as fractionated as it is/
For the NHS to warrant more money, they should come up with the deliverables to take the service forward rather then backwards. And get GPs to actually see their "customers".

Because to think of the NHS as one organisation is naive. It’s a collection of hundreds. It’s a bit easier when you get to Wales and Scotland, but England is a collection of dozens of local authorities, integrated care partnerships, integrated care systems etc etc. So no, it’s nowhere near as simple as you describe. If only.

And that I don't doubt - but I am not convinced it needs the bureaucracy it current has. I can also see why you need several regions - but they all need a Chief Exec ?
There is a need to review what the NHS can / should offer but unfortunately its recent canonisation has meant the any criticism is right wing shit stirring ...

[Mr. Dazzle]

Again also only from my personal anecdotes, but the NHS also wastes loads on duplication.

By way of small example, when Mrs D broke her ankle she got given a "so you've broken you ankle?" type leaflet by the hospital. Which she promptly lost.

So she goes online to find some advice from the NHS, only to find that pretty much every trust has their version of said leaflet and they don't all agree on the best course of action. In some regards they totally contradict each other. It was the same when I had eye surgery.

Now I can totally get how different regions need different care systems. But seriously?

[irie]

Again also only from my personal anecdotes, but the NHS also wastes loads on duplication.

By way of small example, when Mrs D broke her ankle she got given a "so you've broken you ankle?" type leaflet by the hospital. Which she promptly lost.

So she goes online to find some advice from the NHS, only to find that pretty much every trust has their version of said leaflet and they don't all agree on the best course of action. In some regards they totally contradict each other. It was the same when I had eye surgery.

Now I can totally get how different regions need different care systems. But seriously?

Well you live in Narfuck and you know the 'special' eye problems there, doncha?

[Mr. Dazzle]

When did they move MK? My eyes must be really bad if I didn't notice.

[irie]

When did they move MK? My eyes must be really bad if I didn't notice.

Ah yes, my bad, forgot you are in MK.

[Mr. Dazzle]

It even says under my name.

I don't want to say poor obs. But poor obs.

[irie]

It even says under my name.

I don't want to say poor obs. But poor obs.

Agreed, poor obs.

[Horse]

It even says under my name.

I don't want to say poor obs. But poor obs.

Rather ironic when it was talking about eye problems

[Yambo]

[Mr Moofo]

All of a sudden Tony Benn talks sense.

sad that the quote was made in November 1995 - not much seems to have changed

[Skub]

All of a sudden Tony Benn talks sense.

sad that the quote was made in November 1995 - not much seems to have changed

More relevant than ever.

[Taipan]

As a somewhat regular user of the NHS for myself, (not so often), my Step Mother (often) and Step Father (increasingly often) I can report with some authority, the NHS is fucked, or at least round here it is. I'd be quite happy to chuck in a few quid extra tax if I thought it'd do any good, but I sincerely doubt it would. It needs restructuring, but not by the current incumbent of restructureres. If anyone is really bored I'll give you one example of my many frustrating experiences below.

I had cause to visit a respiratory specialist due to a shadow on my lung. Based on the radiologists report, it needed to be monitored. So I'm booked for another CT scan in 3 months time, which I have, and then I try to book the next one as I leave. But, they can't do that, I have to wait and they'll be in touch. They don't get in touch, so I ring them but can't get through. I go down there and they happily rebook me. Quite WTF they couldn't do that when I left last time I don't know, but this happens three more times until i'm changed to an annual check. They will not book my next appointment as I leave, but each time I go back in there and say no ones contacted me for my next follow up, they say they don't know what's happened there but will happily book it for me now!

After annual CT check I make an appointment to see Respiratory Specialist guy. I get there and book in at the reception desk. She hands me back my appointment letter, mumbles a room number to wait outside, which I do. RS guy eventually opens his door and calls my name. I go in and hand him my appointment letter. Anyway, no change, all good, see you next year. He bins my appointment letter as I leave.

Next year same procedure, I book in at the reception desk. She points to the same corridor and say to see the auxiliary staff down there. I do this. They take my letter and put it in a wall tray thing outside RS guys room. Then a Lady, his secretary apparently, comes out, picks up the appointment letter and goes back in. Some time later she comes back out, calls my name and gives me back my appointment letter to give to the RS guy and ushers me into his office. No change, all good, see you next year. He bins my appointment letter as I leave.

Next year another strand is added. Auxiliary Girl takes me to a new area with a man who reads my appointment letter and then weighs me and takes my BP. He gives me back my appointment letter to give back to the auxiliary girl, whom he calls in from outside. I give my appointment letter to the auxiliary girl. She takes me back to the original area and puts my letter and put it in a wall tray thing outside RS guys room. Then a Lady, his secretary apparently, comes out, picks up the appointment letter and goes back in. Some time later she comes back out, calls my name and gives me back my appointment letter to give to the RS guy and ushers me into his office. No change, all good, see you next year. He bins my appointment letter as I leave.

For the next two years this goes on with another strand added each time. Final year before I was discharged, it went to a self check in system that didn't work and you then had to go back to the original lady at the reception desk and start all over again. Over a 5 year period I saw the administration of the dept massively increase its number of tasks involved to see your Doctor and a greater number of staff added to the dept with increasingly longer queuing times added each year. For me, as a user, the NHS just continues to grow in size and inefficiency. I contrast that with the (public sector) places I deal with, whom have had their budgets slashed and staffing levels cut and can't help but wonder why the NHS continues in the manner it does?

[irie]

As a somewhat regular user of the NHS for myself, (not so often), my Step Mother (often) and Step Father (increasingly often) I can report with some authority, the NHS is fucked, or at least round here it is. I'd be quite happy to chuck in a few quid extra tax if I thought it'd do any good, but I sincerely doubt it would. It needs restructuring, but not by the current incumbent of restructureres. If anyone is really bored I'll give you one example of my many frustrating experiences below.

I had cause to visit a respiratory specialist due to a shadow on my lung. Based on the radiologists report, it needed to be monitored. So I'm booked for another CT scan in 3 months time, which I have, and then I try to book the next one as I leave. But, they can't do that, I have to wait and they'll be in touch. They don't get in touch, so I ring them but can't get through. I go down there and they happily rebook me. Quite WTF they couldn't do that when I left last time I don't know, but this happens three more times until i'm changed to an annual check. They will not book my next appointment as I leave, but each time I go back in there and say no ones contacted me for my next follow up, they say they don't know what's happened there but will happily book it for me now!

After annual CT check I make an appointment to see Respiratory Specialist guy. I get there and book in at the reception desk. She hands me back my appointment letter, mumbles a room number to wait outside, which I do. RS guy eventually opens his door and calls my name. I go in and hand him my appointment letter. Anyway, no change, all good, see you next year. He bins my appointment letter as I leave.

Next year same procedure, I book in at the reception desk. She points to the same corridor and say to see the auxiliary staff down there. I do this. They take my letter and put it in a wall tray thing outside RS guys room. Then a Lady, his secretary apparently, comes out, picks up the appointment letter and goes back in. Some time later she comes back out, calls my name and gives me back my appointment letter to give to the RS guy and ushers me into his office. No change, all good, see you next year. He bins my appointment letter as I leave.

Next year another strand is added. Auxiliary Girl takes me to a new area with a man who reads my appointment letter and then weighs me and takes my BP. He gives me back my appointment letter to give back to the auxiliary girl, whom he calls in from outside. I give my appointment letter to the auxiliary girl. She takes me back to the original area and puts my letter and put it in a wall tray thing outside RS guys room. Then a Lady, his secretary apparently, comes out, picks up the appointment letter and goes back in. Some time later she comes back out, calls my name and gives me back my appointment letter to give to the RS guy and ushers me into his office. No change, all good, see you next year. He bins my appointment letter as I leave.

For the next two years this goes on with another strand added each time. Final year before I was discharged, it went to a self check in system that didn't work and you then had to go back to the original lady at the reception desk and start all over again. Over a 5 year period I saw the administration of the dept massively increase its number of tasks involved to see your Doctor and a greater number of staff added to the dept with increasingly longer queuing times added each year. For me, as a user, the NHS just continues to grow in size and inefficiency. I contrast that with the (public sector) places I deal with, whom have had their budgets slashed and staffing levels cut and can't help but wonder why the NHS continues in the manner it does?

The NHS is a modern Erysichthon.

[Horse]

Another example of terrible service:

2019
GP in June
By the end of the year I'd had:
Hearing test
ENT consultant
Balance test
MRI
Neuro appt received

Next year (2020)
Neurosurgeon consultant
Additional MRIs
CT
X-ray
Dynamic MRI
2nd Neuro consultant opinion
Second appointment with first consultant. Operation too complicated so:
3rd Neuro consultant

Covid arrives

4th Neuro consult by phone
Fitted with collar
Pre-op session

Operation in August 2020

Post-op follow-up call
CT
Physio sessions
Follow-up call