In todays news...

[Cousin Jack]

I am another floating voter. I am naturally conservative with a small c, but what I would really like is a left-wing of the Tory party government, with a strong hint of pragmatism, prepared to work with any other party for the good of the country.

That is never on offer, so I support whoever promises to come closest to that ideal. That usually means Conservative, but not if they start getting stupid.

[Pirahna]

I'm proud of my track record of never having voted Conservative.

[Le_Fromage_Grande]

I'm proud of my track record of never having voted Conservative.

Why?

[Horse]

I am a floating voter.

As opposed to a voting floater?

[X] Should be a poll

[Ant]

Probably because he wants to go back to paying more income tax and giving money and assets away......

[Pirahna]

I'm proud of my track record of never having voted Conservative.

Why?

Many reasons, but basically Conservative values are so far removed from my own. Sometimes it's worth stopping for a moment and thinking about what's going on around you. Did you get a train to work today? Many people took an Arriva train, the state owned German railway company which uses UK public transport to subsidise the German system. Used any electricity today? You might well be making it cheaper for the French to plug their kettles in.

Then there's the slow death of the NHS. Got private heath insurance (I'm guilty of this), the doctor who treated you probably did so splitting her time between the NHS and private hospitals, letting the NHS waiting list grow ever longer. Under funding of every part of the health service and allowing private systems to fill the gaps.

In my head the list goes on and on. Run everything at maximum profit and fuck off if you can't afford it. Didn't some minister recently say that if the cost of living is hurting to get a better job.

[Ant]

Health service under funded? If they can pay £250k for a rainbow and £70k salaries for Diversity managers, both for every trust, then they have too much money.

[Pirahna]

Health service under funded? If they can pay £250k for a rainbow and £70k salaries for Diversity managers, both for every trust, then they have too much money.

Absolutely. But then are trusts (a Labour thing, but done under Blair so basically Tory) the way forward?

[JackyJoll]

I'm proud of my track record of never having voted Conservative.

Why?

It’s easier than thinking.

[JackyJoll]

At last, the clutch surrogate cylinder!

https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/news/ ... w-24340890

bosses ditch the word 'slave' to describe car parts

[Cousin Jack]

Many reasons, but basically Conservative values are so far removed from my own.

I hear what you say, but I actually worked in the alternative, a 'nationalized industry in the good old days.

Old Spanish customs, eg scheduling a weeks permitted sick leave
Zero accountability at all levels.
Stasis - any change positively discouraged.
Regularly starved of capital by the Treasury most of the time.
Occasionally ordered by the politicians to spend money on outdated stuff that was not needed.
Primary aim was to avoid doing ANYTHING that might involve the political masters in controversy. No risk, no gain.

If you think today is bad (and it is far from perfect) I can assure you the continuation of nationalization would deliver a far worse experience.

.

[Pirahna]

Many reasons, but basically Conservative values are so far removed from my own.

I hear what you say, but I actually worked in the alternative, a 'nationalized industry in the good old days.

Old Spanish customs, eg scheduling a weeks permitted sick leave
Zero accountability at all levels.
Stasis - any change positively discouraged.
Regularly starved of capital by the Treasury most of the time.
Occasionally ordered by the politicians to spend money on outdated stuff that was not needed.
Primary aim was to avoid doing ANYTHING that might involve the political masters in controversy. No risk, no gain.

If you think today is bad (and it is far from perfect) I can assure you the continuation of nationalization would deliver a far worse experience.

.

I started work in a nationalised industry too, I worked for the MOD at the Royal Small Arms Factory in Enfield first as an apprentice then toolmaker. It closed in 1987 after a "back door" privatisation when the ordnance factory group was sold off to British Aerospace. The ordnance factories were well run places but I get your point when it comes to stuff like British Rail or various electricity boards. But maybe a change in the way the places were managed was needed, not for the state to wash their hands of them.

[Horse]

Old Spanish customs, eg scheduling a weeks permitted sick leave

No point in being off sick if you're not feeling well

[Le_Fromage_Grande]

I'm proud of my track record of never having voted Conservative.

Why?

Many reasons, but basically Conservative values are so far removed from my own. Sometimes it's worth stopping for a moment and thinking about what's going on around you. Did you get a train to work today? Many people took an Arriva train, the state owned German railway company which uses UK public transport to subsidise the German system. Used any electricity today? You might well be making it cheaper for the French to plug their kettles in.

Then there's the slow death of the NHS. Got private heath insurance (I'm guilty of this), the doctor who treated you probably did so splitting her time between the NHS and private hospitals, letting the NHS waiting list grow ever longer. Under funding of every part of the health service and allowing private systems to fill the gaps.

In my head the list goes on and on. Run everything at maximum profit and fuck off if you can't afford it. Didn't some minister recently say that if the cost of living is hurting to get a better job.

I should have been more specific, I meant why are you proud of it, rather than why didn't you vote Conservative, but that could be the same thing.

[Le_Fromage_Grande]

a change in the way the places were managed was needed, not for the state to wash their hands of them.

I totally agree with that, selling off the nations assets, including Council Houses, was one of worst things done by British politicians in my lifetime (2nd Gulf War was worse btw)

[Noggin]

But maybe a change in the way the places were managed was needed, not for the state to wash their hands of them.

To me, this is what's needed in the NHS.

They do get a shit ton of money and are the biggest employer in europe. So on that basis, maybe managing staff and money better is the answer.

[slowsider]

Many reasons, but basically Conservative values are so far removed from my own.

I hear what you say, but I actually worked in the alternative, a 'nationalized industry in the good old days.

Old Spanish customs, eg scheduling a weeks permitted sick leave
Zero accountability at all levels.
Stasis - any change positively discouraged.
Regularly starved of capital by the Treasury most of the time.
Occasionally ordered by the politicians to spend money on outdated stuff that was not needed.
Primary aim was to avoid doing ANYTHING that might involve the political masters in controversy. No risk, no gain.

If you think today is bad (and it is far from perfect) I can assure you the continuation of nationalization would deliver a far worse experience.

.

There is merit in what you say, but remember why the industries were nationalised in the first place.

[Horse]

But maybe a change in the way the places were managed was needed, not for the state to wash their hands of them.

They do get a shit ton of money and are the biggest employer in europe.

IIRC the French medical system gets something like 25% more govt money per resident than the NHS.

And any time I've visited, it's never seemed over-staffed.

[Pirahna]

But maybe a change in the way the places were managed was needed, not for the state to wash their hands of them.

They do get a shit ton of money and are the biggest employer in europe.

IIRC the French medical system gets something like 25% more govt money per resident than the NHS.

And any time I've visited, it's never seemed over-staffed.

I believe the US is the worlds biggest spender per capita but you really wouldn't want to be reliant on their system.

[Horse]

They do get a shit ton of money and are the biggest employer in europe.

IIRC the French medical system gets something like 25% more govt money per resident than the NHS.

And any time I've visited, it's never seemed over-staffed.

I believe the US is the worlds biggest spender per capita

Govt funded, or private?

FWIW, I have no direct experience of the French system, but I know it has served friends well.