My Orange Royal Enfield- New Bike Thread

Discussions and updates on your new bike, your new build, your wishes, wants and desires
Julian_Boolean
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Re: My Orange Royal Enfield- New Bike Thread

Post by Julian_Boolean »

weeksy wrote: Thu Oct 01, 2020 2:03 pm
IN simple terms, to run with the group, it's pretty damn tough on bikes that are underpowered.
I've no interest in "running with the group", as I said the reason for me being on track is to push my cornering limits, not ride round with my chums.
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Re: My Orange Royal Enfield- New Bike Thread

Post by Julian_Boolean »

Tricky wrote: Thu Oct 01, 2020 2:11 pm but a YPVS can still be made to go round corners and get around a circuit at a decent speed without needing expensive special bits
Probably find out next year, as the intention is to use it on track, if it floats my boat more than my FZR400 then the FZR will be sold (well maybe, as selling bikes isn't something I like to do and it's only worth about £1500)
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Re: My Orange Royal Enfield- New Bike Thread

Post by Couchy »

Ace stuff, I like these little bikes because as we get older and slower we can now blame the bike 🤣

My CBR500R is 52hp at the wheel but does weigh a fair bit more than the 390 so it’ll be interesting. The Enfield will be mid to high 50’s with the cam and high comp pistons but again weighs more and has a much more basic chassis. I can imagine the ktm and Honda being fairly equal. I’ve never been this excited about a trip abroad before 👍
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Re: My Orange Royal Enfield- New Bike Thread

Post by Nobby »

I could get mine around Brands Indy in the 57s and Snetterton in sub 1:20 -

That's unlucky , didn't you ever have any dry races ?
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Re: My Orange Royal Enfield- New Bike Thread

Post by KungFooBob »

Nobby wrote: Thu Oct 01, 2020 5:38 pm I could get mine around Brands Indy in the 57s and Snetterton in sub 1:20 -

That's unlucky , didn't you ever have any dry races ?
When you came to see me I couldn't get under 1m dead... it was a bit cold and I'd never been before and the sun was getting in my eyes and, and, and...
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Re: My Orange Royal Enfield- New Bike Thread

Post by Nobby »

KungFooBob wrote: Thu Oct 01, 2020 6:44 pm
Nobby wrote: Thu Oct 01, 2020 5:38 pm I could get mine around Brands Indy in the 57s and Snetterton in sub 1:20 -

That's unlucky , didn't you ever have any dry races ?
When you came to see me I couldn't get under 1m dead... it was a bit cold and I'd never been before and the sun was getting in my eyes and, and, and...
and I still haven't told anyone. But then you were on a bit of a 🚜, and in Trickys day, the Track layout was 3 seconds faster.
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Re: My Orange Royal Enfield- New Bike Thread

Post by Tricky »

Couchy wrote: Thu Oct 01, 2020 4:52 pm Ace stuff, I like these little bikes because as we get older and slower we can now blame the bike 🤣

My CBR500R is 52hp at the wheel but does weigh a fair bit more than the 390 so it’ll be interesting. The Enfield will be mid to high 50’s with the cam and high comp pistons but again weighs more and has a much more basic chassis. I can imagine the ktm and Honda being fairly equal. I’ve never been this excited about a trip abroad before 👍
Yeah me too, gonna be proper fun , and the first time in a gazillion years that I'm even considering taking a selection of sprockets to a TD :lol: :thumbup:
Nobby wrote: Thu Oct 01, 2020 5:38 pm I could get mine around Brands Indy in the 57s and Snetterton in sub 1:20 -

That's unlucky , didn't you ever have any dry races ?
Nah, I never even bothered getting out of bed unless it was torrential rain or snowing :D - anyway, you're older than me , so it stands to reason you should have been even fasterer than me ;)
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Re: My Orange Royal Enfield- New Bike Thread

Post by Nobby »

Tricky wrote: Thu Oct 01, 2020 6:55 pm
Couchy wrote: Thu Oct 01, 2020 4:52 pm Ace stuff, I like these little bikes because as we get older and slower we can now blame the bike 🤣

My CBR500R is 52hp at the wheel but does weigh a fair bit more than the 390 so it’ll be interesting. The Enfield will be mid to high 50’s with the cam and high comp pistons but again weighs more and has a much more basic chassis. I can imagine the ktm and Honda being fairly equal. I’ve never been this excited about a trip abroad before 👍
Yeah me too, gonna be proper fun , and the first time in a gazillion years that I'm even considering taking a selection of sprockets to a TD :lol: :thumbup:
Nobby wrote: Thu Oct 01, 2020 5:38 pm I could get mine around Brands Indy in the 57s and Snetterton in sub 1:20 -

That's unlucky , didn't you ever have any dry races ?
Nah, I never even bothered getting out of bed unless it was torrential rain or snowing :D - anyway, you're older than me , so it stands to reason you should have been even fasterer than me ;)
I'm older than everyone. Guess where I'm off to in the morning ? The weather should be right up your street.
#takesomeextrastrapstotieevertthingdown
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Tricky
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Re: My Orange Royal Enfield- New Bike Thread

Post by Tricky »

Nobby wrote: Thu Oct 01, 2020 6:53 pm
KungFooBob wrote: Thu Oct 01, 2020 6:44 pm
Nobby wrote: Thu Oct 01, 2020 5:38 pm I could get mine around Brands Indy in the 57s and Snetterton in sub 1:20 -

That's unlucky , didn't you ever have any dry races ?
When you came to see me I couldn't get under 1m dead... it was a bit cold and I'd never been before and the sun was getting in my eyes and, and, and...
and I still haven't told anyone. But then you were on a bit of a 🚜, and in Trickys day, the Track layout was 3 seconds faster.
Oy! that's not fair, thought that us old has/never-was-beens would stick together!

( Bottom bend was possibly teeny tiny bit faster in the olden days, but that was it- 3 seconds my arse- maybe on a push bike.... ;) )
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Re: My Orange Royal Enfield- New Bike Thread

Post by Couchy »

I’ve been in the classic race shop next door eyeing up race fairings, I reckon the Enfield could benefit from one and a +1 front sprocket 🤣
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Re: My Orange Royal Enfield- New Bike Thread

Post by Nobby »

Tricky wrote: Thu Oct 01, 2020 7:02 pm
Nobby wrote: Thu Oct 01, 2020 6:53 pm
KungFooBob wrote: Thu Oct 01, 2020 6:44 pm

When you came to see me I couldn't get under 1m dead... it was a bit cold and I'd never been before and the sun was getting in my eyes and, and, and...
and I still haven't told anyone. But then you were on a bit of a 🚜, and in Trickys day, the Track layout was 3 seconds faster.
Oy! that's not fair, thought that us old has/never-was-beens would stick together!

( Bottom bend was possibly teeny tiny bit faster in the olden days, but that was it- 3 seconds my arse- maybe on a push bike.... ;) )
"Graham Hill Bend" was flat out from Druids all the way to Surtees on a 250 , whereas now it's on the brakes , down 1* and accelerate out. That stretch could also now be a smidge longer.
I could ask around this weekend , but when I start up about the good old Days , they look at me like I'm some kind of old c#$t
* or 2 🚲 depending.
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Re: My Orange Royal Enfield- New Bike Thread

Post by Harry »

This is my LC curve.
Standard bike with matched/balanced pistons and a power dynamo ignition - but other than that it's a standard engine.

The peak figure was 45.5bhp @ 9248rpm - but as you can see after 8,000 not much is happening, mostly because of restrictive exhausts.
I reckon 45bhp for a standard bike is very good on an LC, it was previously 39bhp but the NOS barrels, balanced and matched pistons, plus a magic ignition gave it 6bhp.

I think the bendy frame would let it down in a race against the KTM, but it would be fun.
(I was only ever a mid-pack club racer and these days I'm a 'go steady because no one will pay the bills if I'm knackered' racer.
I'd have a go, but I reckon a lack of skill on my part and a superior frame/engine/suspension on Tricky's bike would see him winning.

I reckon if you put two identical riders on the bikes then the KTM would win, easier power, less fickle delivery to the back wheel and a more taut modern set-up.

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Re: My Orange Royal Enfield- New Bike Thread

Post by Mr. Dazzle »

Harry wrote: Fri Oct 16, 2020 4:36 am This is my LC curve.
Standard bike with matched/balanced pistons and a power dynamo ignition - but other than that it's a standard engine.

The peak figure was 45.5bhp @ 9248rpm - but as you can see after 8,000 not much is happening, mostly because of restrictive exhausts.
I reckon 45bhp for a standard bike is very good on an LC, it was previously 39bhp but the NOS barrels, balanced and matched pistons, plus a magic ignition gave it 6bhp.

I think the bendy frame would let it down in a race against the KTM, but it would be fun.
(I was only ever a mid-pack club racer and these days I'm a 'go steady because no one will pay the bills if I'm knackered' racer.
I'd have a go, but I reckon a lack of skill on my part and a superior frame/engine/suspension on Tricky's bike would see him winning.

I reckon if you put two identical riders on the bikes then the KTM would win, easier power, less fickle delivery to the back wheel and a more taut modern set-up.

That's proper funny how the power goes up a cliff :D I have never ridden a proper 2 stroke (only mopeds) but I imagine this is the power band people speak of...
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Re: My Orange Royal Enfield- New Bike Thread

Post by Julian_Boolean »

45 bhp from a stock LC is good, the Yamaha press bikes made 43 when dyno tested by Motorcycle Mechanics (became Performance Bikes in 1985) they tested a YPVS at 49 bhp.

I think the KTM will be faster round a track, I think a stock Yamaha R3 would be faster round Cadwell than a YPVS, just because the chassis is a lot better, I'm more interested to see how the engines compare, if a modern 4 stroke single can make similar power to a two stroke of a similar capacity, especially the torque, my 1991 FZR400 makes more power than my YPVS, but it does it at 15000 rpm not 9000 rpm, the YPVS has far more torque than the FZR
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Re: My Orange Royal Enfield- New Bike Thread

Post by Harry »

Mr. Dazzle wrote: Fri Oct 16, 2020 9:30 am
That's proper funny how the power goes up a cliff :D I have never ridden a proper 2 stroke (only mopeds) but I imagine this is the power band people speak of...
It has it's moments.
A light pull on the bars or even weight distribution on the back will see it loop itself in second if you hit the power right.

The YPVS has a more aggressive riding position and it happens less because your weight is naturally more forward.
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Re: My Orange Royal Enfield- New Bike Thread

Post by Tricky »

A well sorted YPVS, or TZR250 for that matter will smoke a standard 390 in a straight line, at least one without a fairing- I did a few TDs on my 390 Duke, and at Rockingham there were a couple of YPMs, both 3MAs, one of which I had real good fun with in one session, every single lap he would breeze by me on top speed 3/4 way along the front straight , but having said that, my last 390 would just about break 100mph on the clock flat out with chin on the tank, a decent LC or TZR has 20mph on that
The new baby , being an RC390 does of course have a fairing, so am pretty sure that will help a good bit at these power levels, and am also hopefull of a few more hp at the top end with the airbox and exhaust mods, and who knows whatever else ;)

Having said that, I've not done anything with this one yet, but for interest, and comparison with Harry's graph, this was my 2017 390 Duke after a morning on the Dyno fiddling with the fuelling and ignition maps.
The line that says "all stock" isn't in fact all stock, it was with Powertronics developed generic map for the 390 on there- all stock it was peaking at just about 39hp, with a very jaggedly curve and AF very lean

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Re: My Orange Royal Enfield- New Bike Thread

Post by Mr. Dazzle »

My old 400cc Honda CB1 with 33bhp restrictor washers in could crack a tonne, so I'm a bit surprised a much newer and more powerful bike struggles to.

It was only dragging my 17 year old 10.5 stone arse around TBF.
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Re: My Orange Royal Enfield- New Bike Thread

Post by Julian_Boolean »

The KTM probably has a more truthful speedo than the CB1
For reference my standard 250LC scraped an indicated 100, my 350LC with Microns indicated 115 with no problems, YPVS 350 with Allspeeds indicated 120, with a stage 2 Stan Stephens tune about 130, I think the speedo only went to 120 or 125, and with Lomas pipes probably about 135, it has to be remembered that in 1983 when the YPVS was first made the only bikes that genuinely did more than 135 straight off the showroom floor where the Unitrak GPZ1100 and the CB1100R, I don't know about the CB but the YPVS could easily out corner the GPZ.

My very tired 1986 TZR250 did about 105mph, but it handled really well.

I'm not expecting great things from the YPVS I've got now, I weigh 35% more than I did when I had the last one, so I'm expecting a top speed of about 110mph, and I won't be surprised if that turns out to be nearer 100mph
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Re: My Orange Royal Enfield- New Bike Thread

Post by Tricky »

Julian_Boolean wrote: Fri Oct 16, 2020 12:07 pm ........
I'm not expecting great things from the YPVS I've got now, I weigh 35% more than I did when I had the last one, so I'm expecting a top speed of about 110mph, and I won't be surprised if that turns out to be nearer 100mph
Bring it to Porto and give it a proper run out :thumbup:

(probably advisable to pack a few spare pistons too- i's a long main straight there :D ;) )
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Re: My Orange Royal Enfield- New Bike Thread

Post by Harry »

Was the old 390 revving out at 100mph?

The YPM bikes are a fair bit lighter I would have thought, so they'll accelerate quicker and obviously reach their top speed quicker.
Plus being racing chaps they were probably better geared for the track.

I can only imagine a 20-30mph top speed difference on bikes of similar weight, similar drag and the same bhp is down to gearing?